1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:15,000 This is Hacker Public Radio Episode 3,844 for Thursday the 27th of April 2023. 2 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:22,240 Today's show is entitled, 2022-2023 New Years Show Episode 6. 3 00:00:22,240 --> 00:00:25,640 It is part of the series HP or New Year's show. 4 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:32,040 It is hosted by HP or volunteers and is about 121 minutes long. 5 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:34,840 It carries an explicit flag. 6 00:00:34,840 --> 00:00:40,640 The summary is 2022-2023 New Years Show where people come together and chat. 7 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:43,640 Can I do something personal real quick? 8 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:45,640 Depends on how personal. 9 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:49,800 Someone tried saying hello to me as if I'm somebody and I talked to them because I was too afraid 10 00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:50,800 to lose my own train of thoughts. 11 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:55,800 So I just would like to say hello to you. 12 00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:56,800 Infamous, maybe. 13 00:00:56,800 --> 00:01:00,800 I think the only thing I'm famous for is being infamous and I'll screw up. 14 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:01,800 But thank you. 15 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:02,800 Hello? 16 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:04,800 Is that by your hand? 17 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:05,800 Yeah. 18 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:06,800 Don't worry about me. 19 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:08,800 It's probably a year we won this. 20 00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:12,800 I remember you for your sub-sub-sub-sub as you're screening. 21 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:14,800 You're coming in. 22 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:15,800 You're coming in. 23 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:16,800 You're coming in. 24 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:17,800 You're coming in. 25 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:18,800 Yeah. 26 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:20,800 That's what a bad topic. 27 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:23,800 What I was going to say is which country has the best beer? 28 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:24,800 Belgium, Belgium. 29 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:26,800 America right now. 30 00:01:26,800 --> 00:01:28,800 With Americans even can make some Belgians. 31 00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:29,800 It's unbelievable. 32 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:30,800 You can make some Belgians. 33 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:32,800 Because if I was done this time, yeah. 34 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:37,800 Well, the US is doing with beer. 35 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:40,800 What Japan did with everything else. 36 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:42,800 They see how people do it. 37 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:47,800 They try it out that way without like pre-judging it and saying it's wrong. 38 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:49,800 And they put their twist on it. 39 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:51,800 And they combine what they've learned. 40 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:55,800 And you know, Japan did it with cars and electronics. 41 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:57,800 And wag you beef. 42 00:01:57,800 --> 00:01:58,800 Whatever. 43 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,800 Watch Tom Sellik, Mr. Baseball. 44 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:03,800 For that speech. 45 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:07,800 But America has done the same with beer and has done really well with it. 46 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:08,800 I did up to Lafayne. 47 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:10,800 It's a few years ago now. 48 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:15,800 And there was a contingent from the USA, obviously, because it's a huge conference. 49 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:17,800 And a few of them, it was their first time here. 50 00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:19,800 No, it had first time in Belgium. 51 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:21,800 And they were like, let's go have some drinks. 52 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:25,800 So we did. And of course, what they didn't realise was two problems. 53 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:28,800 One, the lowest percentage of alcohol you're going to get in a Belgian beer. 54 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:30,800 Usually in a pub is about 9%. 55 00:02:30,800 --> 00:02:32,800 Which is a lot higher than one. 56 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:33,800 So five years. 57 00:02:33,800 --> 00:02:37,800 Four to six percent, you know, that we're used to getting even in the UK. 58 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:39,800 We could usually top out about five for an average. 59 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:41,800 But it also goes well. 60 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:45,800 The maritime I had on belts. 61 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:46,800 Americans don't have the time. 62 00:02:46,800 --> 00:02:48,800 So we have 16 ounces of their smaller. 63 00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:49,800 So you're right. 64 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:50,800 It's a bigger beer. 65 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:53,800 And it's got to taste as much alcohol in it. 66 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:57,800 So we had a very merry bunch of Americans. 67 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:01,800 The fact that, you know, Poké's right. 68 00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:04,800 This is one of the greatest places to get different types. 69 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:08,800 And really well made and really flavorful beers. 70 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:10,800 I mean, it's basically anything you want. 71 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:14,800 Most of your average Americans are still drinking piss water. 72 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:15,800 Good. 73 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:16,800 Let them. 74 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:20,800 It keeps the price down and the really, really good stuff for the rest of us. 75 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:21,800 Right. 76 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:23,800 I mean, I just got all this great stuff here. 77 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:28,800 And if you walk into a bar in middle America and you're, you're a white guy, 78 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:30,800 and you order anything other than a Budweiser, 79 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:32,800 you're probably going to start a fight. 80 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:33,800 You're exposed to, I tell you what. 81 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:35,800 It's not even Budweiser anymore. 82 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:37,800 By the way, it's pronounced piss vasa. 83 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:41,800 The guys that I drink with drink. 84 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:44,800 One guy drinks raspberry, 85 00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:45,800 Natty lights. 86 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:46,800 Another guy drinks. 87 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:47,800 Oh, Natty lights. 88 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:48,800 He's another guy. 89 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:51,800 Like you wouldn't believe with this flavor. 90 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:52,800 The what? 91 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:55,800 And the more flavor than your average Budweiser. 92 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:56,800 I don't know, mate. 93 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:56,800 Okay. 94 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:57,800 No, light is disgusting. 95 00:03:57,800 --> 00:03:59,800 No matter what flavor you freaking put in it. 96 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:00,800 But that's the point. 97 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:02,800 At least it's not a generic Bud Light. 98 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:05,800 Yeah, but Bud Light is better than the, 99 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:08,800 the gagging that I did on that. 100 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:09,800 But Natty lights. 101 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:10,800 Yes, okay. 102 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:12,800 I want the raspberry Natty light. 103 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:13,800 I never had a regular Natty light. 104 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:15,800 The raspberry Natty light made me gagged. 105 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:17,800 I almost chucked it. 106 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:18,800 But they're all nasty. 107 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:19,800 I think it's interesting. 108 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:20,800 You were saying, 109 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:21,800 Okay. 110 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:25,800 Poké, you were saying about the Japanese taking things and excelling. 111 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:28,800 I can attest that that was not the case with beer. 112 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:31,800 And it's not because their beer is bad. 113 00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:32,800 Their beer is absolutely great. 114 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:34,800 They do some amazing craft beers. 115 00:04:34,800 --> 00:04:39,800 They do insist on putting about 20 centimeters of head on a glass, 116 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:41,800 which is just fundamentally wrong. 117 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:44,800 I don't want that to be more head than beer. 118 00:04:44,800 --> 00:04:46,800 Not a few hours for Tim Cook. 119 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,800 So, I don't tend to ask Tim Cook. 120 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:50,800 Mr. Apple. 121 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:51,800 Tim Apple. 122 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:52,800 No, the other Tim Cook. 123 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:54,800 You were just wouldn't ask Tim. 124 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:57,800 Because he was a patriot, dammit. 125 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:01,800 No, Tim Cook is the brewer of Sam Adams. 126 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:05,800 And his first commercials back in the It could have been late 80s, 127 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:06,800 early 90s, mid 90s. 128 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:07,800 I don't know. 129 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:08,800 I was too young to drink at the time. 130 00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:09,800 But I heard them all. 131 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:10,800 He's coming to drink. 132 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:12,800 What's in the white side? 133 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:14,800 I was listening after that. 134 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:15,800 So, I come in. 135 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:17,800 Different than drinking. 136 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 137 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 138 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 139 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 140 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 141 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 142 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 143 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 144 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 145 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 146 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 147 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 148 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 149 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 150 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 151 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 152 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 153 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 154 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 155 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 156 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 157 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 158 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 159 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 160 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 161 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 162 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 163 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 164 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 165 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 166 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 167 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:18,800 Yeah. 168 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:19,800 Yeah. 169 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:20,800 Yeah. 170 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:22,800 Yeah. 171 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:23,800 Yeah. 172 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:24,800 Yeah. 173 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:24,800 Yeah, it's nice. 174 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:25,800 Okay. 175 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:30,800 So you've told me, yeah. 176 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:31,800 Yeah. 177 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:32,800 Well, hey. 178 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:32,800 Yeah. 179 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:33,800 Fine. 180 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:33,800 Yeah. 181 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:34,800 So. 182 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:35,800 Yeah. 183 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:36,800 Yeah. 184 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:38,800 Anyway. 185 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:39,800 And you've never heard of this before. 186 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:41,800 Yeah. 187 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:44,800 Yeah. 188 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:44,800 Yeah. 189 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:45,800 Yeah. 190 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:45,800 Any other people. 191 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:46,800 Yeah. 192 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:47,800 Yeah. 193 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:18,800 You've? 194 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:20,800 That's the same for you. 195 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:23,800 It's like you're like, you're doing the whole new. 196 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:25,800 Somebody said that the point smaller in the America, 197 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:26,800 but I was like, well, OK. 198 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:30,800 The American is fine. 199 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:34,800 It's like, you didn't… 200 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:39,800 In America, you're not supposed to drink until 21. 201 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:42,800 You can drive a car 15, yeah. 202 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:43,800 I'm sorry. 203 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:45,800 With car king killed people. 204 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:55,040 Yeah, the driver or the people in the road, the drinking in the US is 21, but I swear the drinking 205 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:57,040 agent I was 14. 206 00:05:57,040 --> 00:06:02,040 Yeah, the drinking agent the UK is 18, but we all started drinking around about 14. 207 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:03,040 Exactly. 208 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:04,040 Oh yeah. 209 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:05,040 Thank you. 210 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:06,040 Thank you. 211 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:07,040 Come on, Sebastian. 212 00:06:07,040 --> 00:06:08,040 I'm sorry for Bristol. 213 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:10,320 We know what it's like in the West Country. 214 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:14,240 You're raised on sight, or it's in your very least. 215 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:17,480 No, you're also over from Submerset, and you've got nothing to do, but like where's the 216 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:20,480 combine harvest is going to go through the field, drink your cider. 217 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:21,480 Time out. 218 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:22,480 Yeah. 219 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:23,480 Oh my no, no. 220 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:24,480 Exactly. 221 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:25,480 Thank you very much. 222 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:26,480 It's all farm country out there. 223 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:29,000 And the whole thing is, is I swear the state's port is drinking and driving. 224 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:30,000 Lots of states. 225 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:31,000 Yeah. 226 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:32,000 Yeah. 227 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:33,000 I'm out. 228 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:34,000 Hey, Seb, you are causing a lot of feedback. 229 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:36,640 Anytime you're keyed up in anyone else's keyed up, there's huge amounts 230 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:37,640 of echo. 231 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:38,640 The might be. 232 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:39,640 I don't know. 233 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:40,640 It depends. 234 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:41,640 That's up. 235 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:44,200 It'll be one of two things either, you're not using a headset. 236 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:47,040 Or you're like, well, a stiff stick mic. 237 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:49,040 No, it not might be it definitely is. 238 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:53,120 Anytime you're keyed up in anybody else's keys up, it echoes back at everybody. 239 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:54,120 It's definitely a thing. 240 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:55,120 It's definitely happening. 241 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:59,120 I can't tell you what's causing it, but it's it's very clear. 242 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:03,680 It's like software clear, not headphones next to your mic, so it's maybe something 243 00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:04,680 and software. 244 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:05,680 But it could be. 245 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:06,680 If you're not wearing headphones, I'll do it too. 246 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:07,680 But you've got to speak. 247 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:08,680 There's a bit of a bit of a mic. 248 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:09,680 That's it. 249 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:10,680 I find it. 250 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:11,680 Tack your two quiet. 251 00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:12,680 No one could hear anything. 252 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:14,880 And could you repeat that with a little more gain? 253 00:07:14,880 --> 00:07:16,520 I prefer that way to be honest. 254 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:18,120 Yeah, I want George speaking. 255 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:19,920 I don't want to get what George was saying. 256 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:20,920 It's usually not. 257 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:21,920 It went to heck. 258 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:24,360 Oh, that was a good burn. 259 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:28,840 George I was interested, even if the guys who actually know you want George, the British 260 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:34,160 contingent were having a poke at, but you know, you couldn't shout over us. 261 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:35,160 Why? 262 00:07:35,160 --> 00:07:36,160 Why? 263 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:37,160 You've loved me. 264 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:41,480 That's what's because he's just because it's just because his name is the love bug. 265 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:42,480 He doesn't mean he loves you. 266 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:48,480 Well, I know he can get his voice, he doesn't know the love bug. 267 00:07:48,480 --> 00:07:49,480 Yeah, he's kidding. 268 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:50,480 Oh, no. 269 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,480 He says he's got work in. 270 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:53,480 Yeah, I love that. 271 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:56,240 He's a really, really old crappy version of mumbleed for it to work. 272 00:07:56,240 --> 00:08:00,840 I tried to snap version and the flat pack version of the most recent ones. 273 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:02,480 I didn't know I just then would work. 274 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:04,480 I assumed to have a good issues. 275 00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:05,480 No, no, it's difficult to find. 276 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:06,480 I know. 277 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:07,480 He's the same certificate. 278 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:08,480 I used to save certificate. 279 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:14,480 But it was more the fact that they pushed to talk, um, global shortcuts. 280 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:19,480 Whenever I click the add button to say, this is the shortcut I want to use for push to talk. 281 00:08:19,480 --> 00:08:21,480 It didn't do anything. 282 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:28,480 Oh, yeah, I had that problem as well on the version from the arch repository. 283 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:30,480 I had to get the get versions from arch. 284 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:31,480 So I think they've broken some. 285 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:32,480 Yeah, it looks like him. 286 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:33,480 Am I coming? 287 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:34,480 That's fine. 288 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:35,480 It was the same process. 289 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:37,480 This is probably user error. 290 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:38,480 It sounds beautiful. 291 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:40,480 Oh, bless you. 292 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:41,480 No, I mean, he's gone on. 293 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:43,480 He was a fantastic setup. 294 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:46,480 Yeah, you sound really like your level is already set up. 295 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:48,480 Not blowing anybody out. 296 00:08:48,480 --> 00:08:52,480 I could hear almost made out what you said, even when people were walking on you. 297 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:55,480 And when you're the only one talking, you have to gorgeous. 298 00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:56,480 I geez. 299 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:57,480 What are you using? 300 00:08:57,480 --> 00:08:58,480 That is a. 301 00:08:58,480 --> 00:08:59,480 You shut up guys. 302 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:00,480 What might you go? 303 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:05,480 I'm using a Samsung Q2U, which is, I think is the equivalent of the audio 304 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:07,480 technical 2100. 305 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:08,480 It is. 306 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:10,480 It's a really, really nice microphone. 307 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:11,480 Incredibly cheap. 308 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:12,480 Probably works out. 309 00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:15,480 Well, a current exchange rates about 67 cents. 310 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:18,480 But I think back in the day when we actually had a working currency. 311 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:21,480 It was would have been about 60, maybe $70. 312 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:26,480 I think this is one of the ones that Leo that was formally on midcast was recommending. 313 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:28,480 And it's actually on sale right now. 314 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:31,480 Sam was on his menu to one. 315 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:32,480 Q2U. 316 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:33,480 Thank you. 317 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:34,480 Sam Sun. 318 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:35,480 Yes. 319 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:38,480 So XLR and USB. 320 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:40,480 So I'm using it through XLR for a mixer. 321 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:44,480 But the USB option for it works really well as well. 322 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,480 Really does it sound just as good? 323 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:49,480 Minus the mixer or just almost as good? 324 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:50,480 Minus the mixer. 325 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:52,480 Well, I've never used it through USB personally. 326 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:55,480 But the wife does when she does her work from home. 327 00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:57,480 Usually, she will use the same microphones for our show. 328 00:09:57,480 --> 00:10:00,480 Both going through USB for the mixer for the podcast. 329 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,480 But when she's doing her own work, she just takes the USB cable from the back 330 00:10:03,480 --> 00:10:05,480 of the microphone into a laptop. 331 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:06,480 And it just works. 332 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:07,480 And it sounds brilliant. 333 00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:09,480 Oh, this is for Americans. 334 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:12,480 This is $99.99 at Walmart. 335 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:14,480 You five fifty nine on Amazon. 336 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:15,480 Yeah. 337 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:17,480 Fifty five dollars and ninety nine cents on Amazon. 338 00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:19,480 I don't want to say that to you guys. 339 00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:22,480 But I've watched ITR 2100s about eight years ago. 340 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:24,480 I bought three of them for about thirty dollars. 341 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:27,480 So they have gone up in price like crazy. 342 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:30,480 But is that just for the microphone or is that the podcasting set? 343 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:31,480 Which is like your best standard. 344 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:34,480 If that was the best standard. 345 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:35,480 If that was the best standard. 346 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:35,480 Right. 347 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:36,480 What advice? 348 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:37,480 Forget the headphones. 349 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:39,480 The headphones are beyond. 350 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:39,480 Okay. 351 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:40,480 Buy your own. 352 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:41,480 Yeah. 353 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:41,480 Okay. 354 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:44,480 So George, tack geospark. 355 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:46,480 When you spoke up and said that, 356 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,480 the thirty three bucks, you know, 357 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:51,480 saving twenty bucks, twenty two bucks. 358 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:52,480 I would brag about that. 359 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:55,480 If I were in your seat too, but from my seat, 360 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,480 I just heard what your sounds like compared to the love bugs. 361 00:10:58,480 --> 00:10:59,480 It's worth the extra twenty bucks. 362 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:01,480 Actually, I'm not using that mic. 363 00:11:01,480 --> 00:11:02,480 Oh, nice safe. 364 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:03,480 Oh, good save. 365 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:04,480 Thank you. 366 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:05,480 I really didn't. 367 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:06,480 Oh, I didn't want to walk away. 368 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:07,480 Feel like I was mean. 369 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:08,480 Thank you. 370 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:09,480 No, this is a joke. 371 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:12,480 I'm going to the next clue van or some weird off name brand. 372 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:13,480 Drop mic. 373 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:13,480 So. 374 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:15,480 I'm sure I'll go medical medication cold back. 375 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:16,480 Yeah, I know. 376 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:17,480 It's weird. 377 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:18,480 It looks like it does look a medicating. 378 00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:19,480 It looks like it. 379 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:20,480 It's a pretty mic, but it's. 380 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:21,480 It's generic. 381 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:25,480 Did the ex-living give you those weird dreams to love 382 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:27,480 up every single night. 383 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:30,480 Then I think I recognize you even from outside of. 384 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:31,480 But. 385 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:32,480 Okay. 386 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:33,480 I think I remember you. 387 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:35,480 Speaking of prices though, you know, 388 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:37,480 that whole ninety nine dollars ninety nine cents, 389 00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:38,480 you know where that comes from? 390 00:11:38,480 --> 00:11:40,480 Why we do the ninety nine cents thing. 391 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:41,480 It's a cycle of two things, isn't it? 392 00:11:41,480 --> 00:11:43,480 No two dollars is less than a hundred. 393 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:44,480 Yeah, but it's got what's the key. 394 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:45,480 It's buffer. 395 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:46,480 If it knows the key. 396 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:49,480 It's it's that's partially correct. 397 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:51,480 So that's only one side of it. 398 00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:55,480 The actual reason is that when people make sales, 399 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:58,480 and they would be they would skip putting it through the register, 400 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:01,480 because it was just easier to not. 401 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:03,480 But of course, if they have to give change, 402 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:06,480 they have to open the register and record the sale. 403 00:12:06,480 --> 00:12:10,480 So to force them to do that at the end of the day of the registers are. 404 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,480 Exactly, because they had to reach in to get the change. 405 00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:16,480 And that's why they put it to ninety nine cents, 406 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:18,480 because that was the closest they could get to the dollar, 407 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:21,480 while also forcing their employees to open the register. 408 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:22,480 Interesting. 409 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,480 See, I prefer having round number things to pay. 410 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:26,480 You know, if you've got one more. 411 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:28,480 Yeah, no, absolutely. 412 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,480 I mean, some of our local supermarkets have started mail, 413 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:33,480 selling things for, you know, 414 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:34,480 1499. 415 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:36,480 Well, you'd be surprised, actually. 416 00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:39,480 You might have placed it still only take cash. 417 00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:43,480 I live in Germany, and I live in Germany, 418 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:45,480 and they just, they don't do card here. 419 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:47,480 It's just cash. 420 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:48,480 I good for you guys. 421 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:50,480 I just started doing, 422 00:12:50,480 --> 00:12:52,480 um, carrying a little bit of cash again. 423 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:54,480 And it isn't even all that much, 424 00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:57,480 and I almost never use it, but it's empowering. 425 00:12:57,480 --> 00:12:58,480 It really, 426 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:00,480 Well, yeah, the emergency station, 427 00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:01,480 your pocket is always a good thing. 428 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:04,480 But yeah, I haven't actively carried cash 429 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:08,480 other than like having a 20 on me for a decade now. 430 00:13:08,480 --> 00:13:10,480 May you see, you want to get 20, 431 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:12,480 where you have a difference it makes to you. 432 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:14,480 Yeah, get a cash clip. 433 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:15,480 Get a cash clip. 434 00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:17,480 I'm bring that out when you come to pay for something. 435 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:19,480 And you feel like a king, 436 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:22,480 even though that's only, you know, 200 euros in there. 437 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:24,480 That's a good way to draw attention 438 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:26,480 in a lot of the places that I've lived. 439 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:27,480 You've been doing it. 440 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:28,480 It's a good way to get it. 441 00:13:28,480 --> 00:13:29,480 Don't doubt in the parking line. 442 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:31,480 I mean, yeah, but in, I mean, 443 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:33,480 in Berlin, that's not really a, 444 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:34,480 not really a concern. 445 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:36,480 Well, it's been 20 years in El Paso. 446 00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:37,480 I'm very sorry. 447 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:40,480 I'll bring cash with me for a first then, 448 00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:41,480 but, but say, 449 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:42,480 and even at first, 450 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:43,480 they're more, 451 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:46,480 well, two of the stands may even take cards. 452 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,480 There's a piece at the stand to the mentee, 453 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:51,480 and maybe something else. 454 00:13:51,480 --> 00:13:52,480 You see, you say that, 455 00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:55,480 but when I was at a free note live, 456 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:56,480 I went to try and buy, 457 00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:59,480 I told you about the e-max manual that I have. 458 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:02,480 I tried to buy that from the free software foundation stall, 459 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:05,480 and they were trying desperately to use free software 460 00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:06,480 to power the card readers, 461 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:08,480 and it just didn't work. 462 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:09,480 And I was just there like, 463 00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:11,480 I can go and get cash out there like, 464 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:13,480 no, no, no, we'll get this working. 465 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:15,480 It took an hour and a half. 466 00:14:15,480 --> 00:14:17,480 But obviously, that was in Bristol. 467 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:19,480 So, yes, that makes sense. 468 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:20,480 Perfect, sense. 469 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:22,480 You know, you mentioned free software. 470 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:24,480 You know what that reminds me of? 471 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:26,480 Is that free software? 472 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:29,480 No, it reminds me of free software. 473 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:31,480 Yeah, free money. 474 00:14:31,480 --> 00:14:32,480 Okay, money. 475 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:33,480 Software. 476 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:34,480 Yeah. 477 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:36,480 No, no, free is in freedom. 478 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:38,480 I was going to make a recommendation. 479 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:39,480 Sorry. 480 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:40,480 Okay. 481 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:41,480 Okay. 482 00:14:41,480 --> 00:14:42,480 I don't understand. 483 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:45,480 I don't understand. 484 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,480 Oh, this is the time in the place, 485 00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:49,480 but at least let me get my recommendation out first. 486 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:53,480 And then we can make this the time in the place for free versus train. 487 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:54,480 Conversation. 488 00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:55,480 Yeah, please. 489 00:14:55,480 --> 00:15:01,480 Anyway, just in case anyone who hears this doesn't listen to dev random, 490 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:03,480 and I'm sure no one who listens is does. 491 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:06,480 I found an awesome, awesome, awesome app in the F. 492 00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:12,480 Droid store for Android called flavor decks. 493 00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:18,480 And it's built so that you can catalog and take pictures and do star ratings. 494 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:19,480 And it's all personal. 495 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:22,480 If you don't have to share it with anybody or we're take theirs. 496 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:24,480 I would like there for there to be a way to be. 497 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:25,480 But I don't know if there is. 498 00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:26,480 Maybe there is. 499 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:27,480 I don't know. 500 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:33,480 Anyway, and it's it's pre built for whiskey and wine and beer and something else. 501 00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:36,480 But I've been able to make it work for pipe tobacco. 502 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:38,480 I just added it as a category. 503 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:40,480 And it's really, really nice. 504 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:45,480 I did it on you random as our, our F. Droid spotlight, which we don't always do, 505 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:46,480 which is everyone's in a while. 506 00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:48,480 We'll find something in spotlight it. 507 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:49,480 And this made the cut. 508 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:51,480 This is an awesome, awesome little app. 509 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:53,480 What's the name of that again? 510 00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:55,480 Flavor decks. 511 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:58,480 We have a story for those. 512 00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:06,480 Oh, from the west country of England. And again, and perhaps, although it may have been also. 513 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:09,480 It may have originally come from Scotland. 514 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:10,480 Yes. 515 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:12,480 Not now that I think of it. 516 00:16:12,480 --> 00:16:16,480 It's a counter to your money clip, our German. 517 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:20,480 The counter to the argument for the money clip or the argument against the money clip. 518 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:25,480 It was the counter to the argument for the money clip. 519 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,480 And American went to Scotland with a Velcro wallet. 520 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:33,480 And one of the Scottish people said, saw them opening it. 521 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:37,480 And I'm hearing the, the traditional Velcro screech. 522 00:16:37,480 --> 00:16:39,480 I, yes, that's a good Scotch pocket. 523 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:41,480 It screams when you open it. 524 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:43,480 Ha ha ha ha. 525 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:43,480 Yeah. 526 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:46,480 Is that calling Scotch's cheap word that I missed the joke? 527 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:47,480 Yeah. 528 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:48,480 It's got some cheap. 529 00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:50,480 And climate sucks down co-hosts on here. 530 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:52,480 That doesn't necessarily cheap. 531 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:54,480 They just take to spend money. 532 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:55,480 Okay. 533 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:56,480 That's going to be something. 534 00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:59,480 I know it's not the same thing. 535 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:00,480 Okay. 536 00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:04,480 We have a common stereotype that the Scotts are tight-fisted. 537 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:08,480 It's not true from what I've experienced with Scottish people. 538 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:11,480 But it's a funny little, you know, it's a funny stereotype. 539 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:15,480 It's like a stereotype about, you know, people from the West Country always being drunk. 540 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:17,480 Except that one's true. 541 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:22,480 So the couple, the couple differences that I see immediately, not to be in my card. 542 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:29,480 You can be generous and be happy to spend money on friends and family and still be cheap on a day-to-day basis. 543 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:36,480 And you can also be thrifty or frugal and always go for like the best bang for your buck choice after doing some research. 544 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:39,480 If thinking thought too hard about this, that just cheap. 545 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:41,480 I think too hard about everything I can't turn it off. 546 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:42,480 I'm sorry, fellas. 547 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:44,480 I didn't mean to bring it down. 548 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:51,480 There's another story about Americans who have a certain fear of debt. 549 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:59,480 This guy said that his father or grandfather borrowed $10 from a farmer. 550 00:17:59,480 --> 00:18:05,480 And he said, the farmer never asked for his $10 back as long as he paid him a dollar a week. 551 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:06,480 Good deal. 552 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:10,480 If you're the farmer or the other guy, really, if you satisfied with that. 553 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:13,480 I don't understand the point of the story, though. 554 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:20,480 He acknowledged the obligation, but he never had to pay the principal back, just the intro. 555 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:21,480 Yeah. 556 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:22,480 No, I got that. 557 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:25,480 But how did that relate to being afraid of debt? 558 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:26,480 It's basically in America. 559 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:27,480 Yeah. 560 00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:30,480 It's like the total amount of the land up paying is like $52. 561 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:31,480 Is it because just paying the $10? 562 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:32,480 Yeah. 563 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:36,480 I had $25 in student loans and that's low. 564 00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:39,480 $25,000 in student loans is low. 565 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:48,480 I've been paying on it for 10 years and I met like $15,000 and that's only because, you know, 566 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:51,480 we weren't required to pay for a long time and I kept paying. 567 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:58,480 So what you meant was that Americans are afraid to acknowledge the existence of the concept of debt 568 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:01,480 before signing on to more of it than they can afford. 569 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:04,480 Well, it's not a matter of signing on to more of it than you can afford. 570 00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:09,480 They sell you the American dream the only way to get ahead is to go to college, blah, blah, blah, 571 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:11,480 get a better paying job, et cetera, et cetera. 572 00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:14,480 Now granted, most of that is, you know, garbage. 573 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:21,480 But what they don't tell you and what they do with 18 year old kids that don't know any better with their finances 574 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,480 is they do two things to put you in debt. 575 00:19:24,480 --> 00:19:27,480 One, they convince you to go to college that you can't afford to pay for. 576 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,480 And in order to do that, you have to take out loans. 577 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:38,480 And two, you're 18 years old, you need to be able to eat and dress so they get you on a credit card. 578 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:44,480 And then, hey, look, zero APR for the first six months and then afterwards 24%. 579 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:50,480 And they don't tell you how that works until, you know, you're paying it and you keep paying and you keep paying 580 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:53,480 and the amount that you owe keeps staying the same. 581 00:19:53,480 --> 00:19:56,480 The first part, you're 100% correct about the second part. 582 00:19:56,480 --> 00:20:01,480 It can happen at any age, it's not just 18 and I think four has been heat up. 583 00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:09,480 But I think, I think it's predatory when it happens to any senior old that has never handled their own finances before. 584 00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:13,480 Yes, the things you listed are the bait and the credit is the trap. 585 00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:14,480 Yeah. 586 00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:21,480 So I was just going to say, in the UK, we have the world's stupidest sort of student loan system. 587 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:23,480 So we never used to have student loans. 588 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:28,480 We had an equal to student grant and it was basically paid for by taxes. 589 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:29,480 Right. 590 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:34,480 And then, all of a sudden, under the black government, I want to say it's a labour government, 591 00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:37,480 they introduced this idea of student loans. 592 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:41,480 But so student loans can actually get extremely expensive in the UK. 593 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:44,480 Like, you know, America, yes, you know, you're saying $25,000. 594 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:47,480 My debt is currently 47,000 pounds. 595 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:49,480 Did he just sell for every year? 596 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:54,480 Obviously. The reason mine is only $25,000 is because our only came out, 597 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:58,480 $25,000 is because I'm a veteran and I'm a disabled veteran. 598 00:20:58,480 --> 00:20:59,480 Right. 599 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:01,480 And I was getting money from the government to go to school. 600 00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:04,480 It just wasn't enough to actually go to school and live. 601 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:05,480 Sure. 602 00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:07,480 But I've got a friend who, you know, she went to, 603 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:10,480 once I go call now and hers is less than mine. 604 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:14,480 You know, I'm just saying it's not this sort of hard and fast thing of like Americans always pay more. 605 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:17,480 In fact, mine ends up being pretty expensive. 606 00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:20,480 But the deal is a joke, you see. Here's the joke. 607 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:23,480 We pay interest on that every month. 608 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:26,480 And you can, if you want to, start paying it down. 609 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:29,480 But after 30 years, they'll forget the debt anyway. 610 00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:30,480 Explain that. 611 00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:33,480 Because they want 30 years of payments from you. 612 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:37,480 You can actually stop paying and they won't be able to find you most of the time. 613 00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:38,480 Oh, here they'll sign up. 614 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:39,480 I get you. 615 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:42,480 Well, I've already said, but oh, I want to add in. 616 00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:47,480 And then you also university was at 9,000 to get you most of the year. 617 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:50,480 And I think it's gotten pretty, don't they? 618 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:52,480 They do, if you're Scottish. 619 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:53,480 If you're Scottish, yeah. 620 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:58,480 And if you're Scottish and you go to a Scottish university or if you're Welsh and you go to a Welsh university, you get it for free. 621 00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:04,480 If you're English and you go to any university in the UK, you have to pay 9 grand a year, because nobody likes you. 622 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:05,480 The world's hard. 623 00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:11,480 Except for one university, the one that I went to, the university of hard knocks, that's free. 624 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:12,480 Oh, no. 625 00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:13,480 Well, there's a cost. 626 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:14,480 It's just not monetary. 627 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:15,480 It's not. 628 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:16,480 It's not. 629 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:17,480 Indeed. 630 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:29,480 Actually, what you have interesting with with US student loans is the bankers put them ahead of any other debt or payment system. 631 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:30,480 You're on disability. 632 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,480 They'll suck up your student loan. 633 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:35,480 Your, they'll suck up your disability pay to pay off your student loans. 634 00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:36,480 Yes. 635 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:45,480 You can't get rid of the student loans by declaring bankruptcy. 636 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:48,480 You can't get rid of the student loans by dying. 637 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:53,480 It just, they will take it from your estate and anything left over goes to your family. 638 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:54,480 Thanks a lot. 639 00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:55,480 Thanks a lot. 640 00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:56,480 But I didn't. 641 00:22:56,480 --> 00:23:00,480 Yeah, I paid them all early too, because I got it down to a point. 642 00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:02,480 Mind you, I'm in my 50s now. 643 00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:05,480 So I paid them off in my 40s, which is rare. 644 00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:09,480 But I got to a point where I looked at it and it was a certain amount. 645 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:10,480 I'm like, how can I afford that? 646 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:11,480 And I just paid it all off. 647 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:12,480 They were probably. 648 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:13,480 Yeah. 649 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:14,480 Get rid of that interest. 650 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:20,480 I, I may be at a point in my 40s where I earned enough money to pay off my student loans. 651 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:23,480 But on principle, I will not pay off my student loans. 652 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:25,480 I will wait for it to run out. 653 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:26,480 I will stop paying it. 654 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:30,480 The reason for that is that they changed the terms of the agreement after I signed it. 655 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:33,480 So I don't see why I should have to pay them anything. 656 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:35,480 Unfortunately, I'm not one of those people that can. 657 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:36,480 20. 658 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:41,480 I just feel like, you know, they, they, you know, the government changed the terms of the agreement. 659 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:47,480 They changed the terms of the, um, of the sort of, uh, the, they changed the terms of how 660 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,480 student loans were after I'd already signed up the student loans. 661 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:52,480 So that invalidates the agreement I signed. 662 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:54,480 So theoretically, I've not signed any agreement. 663 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:55,480 Did you hear what they did? 664 00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:56,480 Did you hear what they did? 665 00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:57,480 It's the term that you hear. 666 00:23:57,480 --> 00:23:59,480 We do not change them anymore. 667 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:00,480 Did you hear what they did? 668 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:01,480 The teachers here. 669 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:05,480 Um, essentially what happened was teachers require X amount of education, 670 00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:07,480 college education, of course, right? 671 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:12,480 Well, the US government offered to pay for said education. 672 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:18,480 If these teachers worked X amount of years for, uh, community schools, 673 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:19,480 essentially. 674 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,480 And, but you had to pay for it first. 675 00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:25,480 So you had to get the loans and pay for everything first. 676 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:30,480 And then once these teachers went out and actually, you know, got the jobs that they were supposed 677 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:32,480 to get in order to get this all paid for. 678 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:34,480 There were like, no, we ran out of money. 679 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:35,480 We're not paying anything. 680 00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:36,480 Enjoy your loans. 681 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:37,480 Pay them back yourself. 682 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:38,480 Classic. 683 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:39,480 Classic. 684 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:42,480 If I could just take the opportunity to quickly jump in, um, 685 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:43,480 I'm going to take my leave. 686 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:46,480 It's nothing to do with Joe Ressington having shown up. 687 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:47,480 Um, John Ressington. 688 00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:51,480 But the last time he and I, but the last time he and I run an event similar to this one, 689 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:55,480 we ended up talking about monetizing podcasting until four in the morning. 690 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:57,480 And I ended up with a hangover. 691 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:01,480 So you're leaving me now now. 692 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,480 Now, generally, it's not to do with you, Joe. 693 00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:08,480 Um, I would happily speak with you for, you know, the next 12 hours about absolutely nothing 694 00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:09,480 at all. 695 00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:11,480 But, uh, unfortunately, I'm falling asleep. 696 00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:12,480 And my beer is just about to end. 697 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:13,480 Well, let's see. 698 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:15,480 You have to show the love bug later. 699 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:17,480 So, uh, maybe we can tell that later. 700 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:18,480 Yeah. 701 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:19,480 Well, you'll still be. 702 00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:21,480 You'll still be on the go to midday. 703 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:26,480 I think I think has your numbers on me cast a while ago, Joe Ress. 704 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:27,480 Come back. 705 00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:28,480 Hang out. 706 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:29,480 I've agreed. 707 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:31,480 It's been a long, long time since I was on that show in my friend. 708 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:32,480 Yeah. 709 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:33,480 You should come back. 710 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:37,480 I don't really use the next minute anymore, or advice anyone else is. 711 00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:42,480 So it would feel somewhat hypocritical to come back on that show in the fridge. 712 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:43,480 Come back on a roadway. 713 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:44,480 No way. 714 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:45,480 No way. 715 00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:46,480 No way. 716 00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:47,480 Okay. 717 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:48,480 That's crossing a line. 718 00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:49,480 Well, I just realized, Joe. 719 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:50,480 I'm feeling we have it. 720 00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:51,480 We have it. 721 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:52,480 We have it. 722 00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:55,480 Just through a neutral podcast that he could be right. 723 00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:56,480 Yeah. 724 00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:58,480 We don't have good enough, so I'm probably for Joe Ress. 725 00:25:58,480 --> 00:25:59,480 I'm the least luckest. 726 00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:04,480 Well, my it doesn't matter about destroy agnostic. 727 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,480 I have an operating system agnostic approach. 728 00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:09,480 If you use windows, good for you. 729 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:11,480 If you use macOS, good for you. 730 00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,480 If you use WSL, good for you. 731 00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,480 You know, I'm not going to necessarily use those things, but if you want to use it and 732 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,480 you're happy and you get your job done, then I'm not going to judge you. 733 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:24,480 That's not a very nice thing to do is it to judge people's choices. 734 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:26,480 Well, of course, one can sign it. 735 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:28,480 I'm a freaking happy. 736 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:32,480 Well, we are extremely destroy agnostic on mint cast. 737 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:33,480 Believe it or not. 738 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:35,480 Yes, a lot of it is mint focused. 739 00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:39,480 But we're talking about anything that's going on in Linux in general. 740 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,480 Otherwise, we'd run out of things to talk about real quick. 741 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:43,480 Well, yeah. 742 00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:46,480 It's a podcast by the Linux Mint community for all users of Linux. 743 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:47,480 Yeah. 744 00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:48,480 Yeah. 745 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:49,480 It's one of those situations. 746 00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:51,480 We're like, I follow you on Masad on Twitter. 747 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:54,480 And yeah, I've never actually encountered you in a room like this. 748 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:55,480 So, hi. 749 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:56,480 I think, hello. 750 00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:58,480 Do you and I have talked before, haven't we, Joe? 751 00:26:58,480 --> 00:26:59,480 I would imagine so. 752 00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:00,480 Yeah. 753 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:01,480 On here. 754 00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:02,480 Yeah. 755 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:03,480 Yeah. 756 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,480 Almost every year, I pop in for a little bit because my wife goes to bed. 757 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:08,480 And I'm just kind of drunk and bored. 758 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:09,480 So, yeah. 759 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:11,480 I'm kind of drunk and not bored. 760 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:12,480 Is my audio back? 761 00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:13,480 And anyone hear me this time? 762 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:14,480 Yeah. 763 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:14,480 We can hear you. 764 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:15,480 Yeah. 765 00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:16,480 Yes, I'm great. 766 00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:19,480 If you got what Mike's fun if you got, it sounds amazing. 767 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:21,480 I have to look it up on Amazon. 768 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:23,480 It's a little Sony stereo lapel, Mike. 769 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:27,480 I was probably between seven and $17. 770 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:28,480 Wow. 771 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:29,480 Yeah. 772 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:30,480 Sounds absolutely great. 773 00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:31,480 Yeah. 774 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:32,480 It doesn't, like, it's a clip, Mike. 775 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:34,480 It's a little thing you'd clip to your lapel. 776 00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:36,480 So, you've got to clip it someplace stable. 777 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:38,480 And that's hard for me to do. 778 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:41,480 So, it always, often you'll hear it bumping against my shirt. 779 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:43,480 Like that or sliding around or something. 780 00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:44,480 Yeah. 781 00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:45,480 That sounds terrible. 782 00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,480 But when it's in the right position, that sounds absolutely great to me. 783 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:49,480 Yeah. 784 00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:50,480 Yeah. 785 00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:52,480 If you could clip it to a Mike stand, you'd have a podcast set up. 786 00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:55,480 And it's just a two and a half millimeter plug. 787 00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:58,480 It's just, you know, you need a two and a half for the Mike and a two and a half 788 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:02,480 your headphones as opposed to a four ring three and a half that has both. 789 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:03,480 Or an adapter. 790 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:04,480 It's just electrical. 791 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:05,480 Interesting. 792 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,480 Yeah. Well, sounds good as it is now. 793 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:08,480 So, keep doing what you're doing. 794 00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:09,480 It's my advice. 795 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:10,480 Oh, thank you, sir. 796 00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,480 Speaking of monetizing podcasts, 797 00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:14,480 who here has looked into cast a pod. 798 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,480 Not me, but it sounds interesting. 799 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:17,480 Please tell me more. 800 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:18,480 Okay. 801 00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:21,480 So, cast a pod is a federated service. 802 00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:25,480 I know about them because I'm fun, quite a maintainer. 803 00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:28,480 And they do podcasting like we do. 804 00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:30,480 But they do a lot of additional things. 805 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,480 Like they've got a lot of additional features and stuff like that. 806 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,480 Such as monetizing podcasts. 807 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,480 So, you get it's Fediver software, 808 00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,480 but it can do stuff like premium episodes and that sort of thing. 809 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:41,480 How does it monetize them? 810 00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,480 What kind of monetizing when we're talking about? 811 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:46,480 Well, it allows for things like I say, 812 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:48,480 premium episodes. 813 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:50,480 I imagine they integrate with payment providers 814 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:53,480 in a standard way and then produce sort of subscribe 815 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:55,480 a specific RSS feeds. 816 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:57,480 In a similar way, it's something like sub stack. 817 00:28:57,480 --> 00:28:58,480 I don't actually know the technical details, 818 00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:00,480 but I'm guessing that's how they work. 819 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:01,480 And they all hate drugs. 820 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:02,480 They all hate drugs. 821 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:03,480 Yeah, yeah. 822 00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:05,480 So, Patron, why are you so that? 823 00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,480 Yeah, because Patron, I upload advert for RSS feeds. 824 00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:12,480 That advert free episodes to an RSS feed that people can. 825 00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:13,480 Yeah. 826 00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:15,480 And like Patron takes care of all of the back end of that. 827 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:16,480 And when people stop paying, 828 00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:18,480 like the RSS feeds stops working and stuff, 829 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:20,480 and I don't have to do anything. 830 00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:21,480 Is that what you're talking about? 831 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:23,480 Yeah, I'm sure of the financial handling 832 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:25,480 or the content side of it. 833 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:26,480 It's the content specifically. 834 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:28,480 They don't handle all payments. 835 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:30,480 They integrate with payment providers. 836 00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:32,480 I mean, this is one thing you'll notice 837 00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,480 about all of us Fediver's developers. 838 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,480 We do not want to touch payments with a barge pole. 839 00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:39,480 That stuff is far too complicated 840 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:41,480 and needs to be centralized. 841 00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:43,480 It cannot be done in a federated way. 842 00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:46,480 The best we can do in other projects. 843 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:49,480 Well, I've heard of boosts for my friend. 844 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,480 I've heard of the lightning network and boosts 845 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:54,480 and Bitcoin and crypto. 846 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:56,480 That's definitely the answer to this. 847 00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:58,480 And not total bullshit, 848 00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,480 pyramid scheme, Ponzi scheme or whatever. 849 00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:03,480 It's definitely the future. 850 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,480 Jorra, Jorra says that you live on that 851 00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:08,480 or is it just a way to get started? 852 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:12,480 That was sarcasm and I do not recommend any of that. 853 00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:13,480 At all. 854 00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:17,480 And I agree that payment systems have to be centralized 855 00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:21,480 and regulated otherwise bad things happen long term. 856 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:22,480 Well, thank you for clearing that. 857 00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:23,480 Okay. 858 00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:24,480 That sounded sincere. 859 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:26,480 The best that we can do. 860 00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:29,480 British people is hard to tell sometimes. 861 00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:31,480 We sound sarcastic all the time. 862 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:33,480 The best humor is my favorite. 863 00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:35,480 We're don't apologize for that. 864 00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:36,480 They just missed it. 865 00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:37,480 I'm not. 866 00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:39,480 I'm eight and a half out of ten tonight. 867 00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:42,480 Maybe I've been drinking. 868 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:44,480 But the best that we can do is so. 869 00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:47,480 I work on another project called Retribute. 870 00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:50,480 And the idea is that it uses your Fediver's information, 871 00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:54,480 such as you can log in with MasterDarn or peer tube or funquail. 872 00:30:54,480 --> 00:31:00,480 And basically you can get a weighted list of who you've interacted with. 873 00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:02,480 So in the case of funquail, 874 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:04,480 it's what artists have you listened to most. 875 00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:05,480 In the case of MasterDarn, 876 00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:07,480 who have you interacted with most peer tube, 877 00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:10,480 and then it basically aggregates those into a list, 878 00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:15,480 and gives you links to their payment providers that they have put in their profile or in their associated links. 879 00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:23,480 And the idea is we'd like to build on that to be more of a thing with a tool that can use put in place, 880 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,480 budgeting and stuff like that. 881 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:35,480 Just to make that kind of user-driven donation model more readily available and apparent in the Fediver's. 882 00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:39,480 And what podcast to pod do is more traditional. 883 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:41,480 They do sort of, like I say, 884 00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:50,480 they have like, like Patreon, like substat, they have this paid RSS feed for specifically paid content paid episodes. 885 00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:52,480 And they also, I believe, do, 886 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:58,480 they have the ability to add things like region-specific advertising. 887 00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:00,480 I believe it's the thing they can do. 888 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:02,480 Oh, have you heard that personally? 889 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:07,480 I get a lot of it, because I live in Germany, so my podcast that are in English 890 00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:10,480 get disrupted by Germans talking about. 891 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:14,480 Of course I'm just like, when's the first time you notice that? 892 00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:16,480 Oh, it's been there for ages. 893 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:17,480 Like, I've noticed it. 894 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:23,480 I'm think I probably started noticing it around 2017, 2018, something other? 895 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:27,480 Okay, because I was thinking only heard it maybe a year and a half ago. 896 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:33,480 It's becoming really big. 897 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:35,480 Dude, I'm sorry. 898 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:38,480 I hate it, but that is impressive tech that your pod catcher obviously has to report an address. 899 00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,480 But the server can go, okay, that address. 900 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:44,480 We insert these ads at these locations, these timestamps, 901 00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:51,480 and recompile on the fly in less than the time that it takes to download our finished podcast. 902 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:54,480 Well, more than likely what they do is, 903 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:59,480 and I've not looked into the tech, but my imagination is that they have a central server, 904 00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:02,480 and basically they get a report back of a location from the podcast, 905 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:05,480 and they fish out whatever ad makes sense there. 906 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:07,480 It's the same link. 907 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:08,480 I feed. 908 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,480 No, I don't think so. 909 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,480 It's actually way more sinister than that. 910 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,480 If you're dealing with Spotify's one that they bought, 911 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,480 it's way more sinister. 912 00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:25,480 What's the same thing? 913 00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:26,480 All right, don't forget what you're going to say, 914 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:29,480 because I'm going to say whatever Joe's about to say is correct. 915 00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:32,480 And here's why I know what he's about to say is correct. 916 00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:35,480 He's why I know it's not just pre-compiled for the regions, 917 00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:37,480 because I've used it while traveling, 918 00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,480 and you can get there are, 919 00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:44,480 there are venn diagram overlap areas on the physical map of the United States, 920 00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:47,480 where those ads will change in the same episode. 921 00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:50,480 Well, not once it's been downloaded, 922 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:53,480 but from the same server, from the same podcast, 923 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:57,480 and it doesn't take 100 miles or so to do it. 924 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:02,480 I think it is based on, at least here in the States, 925 00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:07,480 the three letter code for the nearest airport, 926 00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:09,480 because that's the way weather is done. 927 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,480 It's not by zip code, it's not as granular as town, 928 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:14,480 but it may be by weather region. 929 00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:17,480 No, it's way more sinister than that, I'm afraid. 930 00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:19,480 It's based on you. 931 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:22,480 It's based on, I mean, in theory, let's face it, 932 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:24,480 this tech is relatively new, 933 00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:26,480 and it's part of the whole ad tech, 934 00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,480 spying, whatever you want to call it, tracking, 935 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:33,480 and we can easily fit into a slot in the database. 936 00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:36,480 Well, yeah, but so the deal with it is, 937 00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:40,480 what you're talking about is dynamically inserted ads, 938 00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:43,480 and so the technology of that's relatively straightforward. 939 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:46,480 It's quite a beefy server, server. 940 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:49,480 Your podcast client requests a download. 941 00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:52,480 They make a decision on what ads are going to get stitched in. 942 00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:54,480 They get stitched in less than a second, 943 00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:55,480 into the order of file, 944 00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:57,480 and then it gets downloaded to your, 945 00:34:57,480 --> 00:34:59,480 or streamed to your device, 946 00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:01,480 and then you have the ads that they have decided. 947 00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:03,480 That's, I mean, we're all technical. 948 00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,480 We understand how you could do that if you had a beefy enough server, 949 00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,480 but how they make the decision, that's the sinister part. 950 00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:14,480 So they, I mean, it's much like how this decision is made 951 00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:19,480 when you're browsing without ad block enabled on web pages. 952 00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:21,480 They are targeted at you. 953 00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:24,480 You, you Google searched for, I don't know, 954 00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:26,480 what did I search for recently? 955 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:27,480 Bluetooth speakers, 956 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:31,480 and then I just get bombarded with loads of different Bluetooth speaker ads 957 00:35:31,480 --> 00:35:32,480 everywhere I go. 958 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:35,480 And so the theory is that there's a punchline. 959 00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:39,480 Sorry, sorry, you've got my other sense this. 960 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,480 I think I was like, why are they talking about that? 961 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:43,480 Although I think I've got this now. 962 00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:44,480 Well, I might be a totally odd one. 963 00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:46,480 But anyway, instead of major, okay? 964 00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:48,480 I listen to say a, 965 00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:53,480 a metal station from Germany or France or whatever, 966 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:55,480 but it'll actually Netherlands begin with. 967 00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:56,480 And what I notice suddenly, 968 00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:59,480 as I was getting my kind of local advert, 969 00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:00,480 like I was looking like, 970 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:04,480 why am I getting a local advert for whatever and Bristol? 971 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,480 Yeah, that's exactly what I'm talking about. 972 00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:10,480 Yeah, I mean, it's a cause of its location. 973 00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:12,480 Obviously. 974 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:15,480 Well, so Joe had my stuff like quick, quick punchline, 975 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,480 and then you get back, please. 976 00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:21,480 It doesn't work because after you buy the Bluetooth speaker, 977 00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:23,480 you get those same ads for the next three months, 978 00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:25,480 so they really don't know shit. 979 00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:26,480 All they can do is watch. 980 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:28,480 That's the upside to this. That's the bright side. 981 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:30,480 Well, that's one way of looking at it. 982 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:31,480 Another way of looking at it is, 983 00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:34,480 I have a return period, and I may see an advert for a Bluetooth speaker 984 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:36,480 that's better than the one that I bought, 985 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:37,480 and I may return this one to Amazon, 986 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:39,480 then you can add it back to India to be burnt, 987 00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:43,480 and then I will buy a better one for a cheaper price potentially. 988 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:45,480 But anyway, as I was saying, 989 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,480 it's kind of based on, 990 00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:51,480 Well, you may have your IP address on the internet radio station, 991 00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:53,480 and go, how are you actually in Britain? 992 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,480 So in that case, here's the other up to you. 993 00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:58,480 But we hear you, Zav, live there, 994 00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:01,480 or just not letting you interrupt the conversation to say to a year you. 995 00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:03,480 Yes, Moss, we hear you. 996 00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:05,480 Ah, well, now I hear me. 997 00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:08,480 I had the headphone plugged in a wrong port. 998 00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:11,480 That's what the repeater bought for. Have you tried the repeater bought? 999 00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:12,480 I have no idea. 1000 00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:15,480 Dude, it's the audio test room. 1001 00:37:15,480 --> 00:37:16,480 If you go in there, 1002 00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:18,480 you'll get a personalized repeater bought 1003 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,480 that you can sound checked before popping into a room. 1004 00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:22,480 Well, I'm good. 1005 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:23,480 Yes, you are. 1006 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:24,480 I hope. 1007 00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:25,480 Anyway, the two long-term rate 1008 00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:28,480 is that it's somewhat based on location. 1009 00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:33,480 They try and make it based on your own profile that they build around you, 1010 00:37:33,480 --> 00:37:37,480 and they are constantly improving that profile on everyone, 1011 00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:40,480 and it is sinister, and I don't like it. 1012 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:41,480 Whatever. 1013 00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:46,480 What is sinister in the way that all add tech and tracking is sinister? 1014 00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:50,480 Because you see, I believe I firmly believe in advertising 1015 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,480 as a way to monetize anything on the internet, 1016 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:55,480 because that's how it's always been done, 1017 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:57,480 and how I believe it will always be done. 1018 00:37:57,480 --> 00:37:59,480 I don't think that people want to pay for things. 1019 00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:01,480 I think people want things for free. 1020 00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:03,480 The bottom line is you need to have ads, 1021 00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:05,480 but I don't believe that those ads need to be targeted at individuals. 1022 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:07,480 I think they need to be targeted to the content. 1023 00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:11,480 So, if you have a great blog post about Bluetooth speakers, 1024 00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:15,480 then you should have a ton of ads next to it about Bluetooth speakers. 1025 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:19,480 And if you have a podcast about Linux and open source, 1026 00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:21,480 then you should have adverts 1027 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,480 that are relevant to the kind of person who would listen to that. 1028 00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:27,480 So, let's say, I answer the same question, sir. 1029 00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:28,480 Yeah. 1030 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:30,480 I'm going to be listening about AFK. 1031 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:34,480 It's sinister in that it feeds you an echo chamber, 1032 00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:36,480 and they don't tell you that that's what they're doing, 1033 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:38,480 and people really like echo chambers, 1034 00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:41,480 so they don't bother to check that that's what's being done. 1035 00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:43,480 Can I just interject here? 1036 00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:44,480 This is my day job. 1037 00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:47,480 I work for a company called Adjust. 1038 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:50,480 We are at mobile, had to take company. 1039 00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:54,480 So, I get to see all this stuff happening on the back end. 1040 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:56,480 I am absolutely on board. 1041 00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:58,480 I don't agree with what we do either. 1042 00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:00,480 Yeah, I'm totally against it. 1043 00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:03,480 It's just a job that got me into a country that I wanted to live in. 1044 00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:05,480 But for a good reason. 1045 00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:09,480 I will just say, on this front, 1046 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:13,480 sinister is perhaps the wrong way to look at it. 1047 00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:18,480 If only because the algorithms, 1048 00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:21,480 quote unquote, that are making these decisions, 1049 00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:26,480 are entirely dumb, have no knowledge of what you are who you are. 1050 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:27,480 Don't want to know. 1051 00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,480 So, when we say personal data is being collected about you, 1052 00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:33,480 the thing that's being collected, at least on the mobile, 1053 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:35,480 I mean, web is worse, web is a lot worse. 1054 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:37,480 Don't let me, you know, don't let me give it. 1055 00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:38,480 Don't get me wrong. 1056 00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:42,480 The web cookie tracking, that stuff is really bad. 1057 00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:44,480 But for mobile tech, 1058 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:50,480 basically your device has a GDPR compliant advertising ID on it. 1059 00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:53,480 It is a string of numbers, it's a UUID, 1060 00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:56,480 basically a string of numbers and text. 1061 00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:58,480 It could be reset at any time. 1062 00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:00,480 And at that point, any data collected on you 1063 00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:02,480 is worthless, frankly, 1064 00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:07,480 because it no longer reports back anything associated with you. 1065 00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:09,480 The app. 1066 00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:10,480 Yeah. 1067 00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:12,480 Go ahead, seven, and I'm next. 1068 00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:15,480 I was talking about the internet media, 1069 00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:16,480 which is read to me the same thing. 1070 00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:18,480 We were talking about it. 1071 00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:21,480 But if I'm just into internet radio, 1072 00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:23,480 and I pick the foreign country, 1073 00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:25,480 I don't want to hear that stupid local advert, 1074 00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:26,480 I already don't. 1075 00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,480 In fact, I've already heard that their adverts, 1076 00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:31,480 like you would on the radio station, 1077 00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:32,480 like it's really just one, 1078 00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:34,480 I was getting the local adverts. 1079 00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:37,480 But they had done by peer dress advertising 1080 00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:39,480 and things like that. 1081 00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:43,480 And then I gave up cookies and other things as well, 1082 00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:44,480 and into that. 1083 00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:46,480 And Google's file, and that's as well. 1084 00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:47,480 Well, yes. 1085 00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:52,480 But who in, so if you want to listen to a podcast 1086 00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:54,480 that sprouts from Indonesia, 1087 00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:57,480 who in Indonesia gives a shit if you hear their ad. 1088 00:40:57,480 --> 00:40:59,480 So those aren't the ones you're going to pay for your hearing. 1089 00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:00,480 Oh, yeah. 1090 00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:02,480 The lumber store up the street from you, 1091 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,480 however, has discovered that people are listening to podcasts, 1092 00:41:05,480 --> 00:41:08,480 and you'll hear an ad for the lumber store up the street from you, 1093 00:41:08,480 --> 00:41:10,480 and they want you to get their ad. 1094 00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:12,480 And I've got to say, 1095 00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:14,480 well done in the execution. 1096 00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:19,480 I don't love the implementation or being subject to it, 1097 00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:22,480 but well done in its implementation. 1098 00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:23,480 Now I forgot my question. 1099 00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:24,480 So continue. 1100 00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:28,480 Well, that's mostly to hear some local advert when you don't want to. 1101 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:30,480 In fact, I want local advert. 1102 00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:33,480 It's a ton of normal radio on the BBC, whatever. 1103 00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:35,480 But that's inside the point. 1104 00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:38,480 That's not one of the ads. 1105 00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:39,480 You either get ads and you pay for the content. 1106 00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:41,480 That's neither here nor there. 1107 00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:43,480 I'm just saying, if you have to have ads, 1108 00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:46,480 it's better for the guy paying for the ad 1109 00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:48,480 that he hits someone local. 1110 00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:50,480 And frankly, it's probably better for me 1111 00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:52,480 if the guy pay into someone local. 1112 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:54,480 Because at least then I got a chance 1113 00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,480 of keeping a small business in business. 1114 00:41:57,480 --> 00:41:58,480 Well, I guess just due to repeat, 1115 00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:00,480 I don't know what I'm tendable from, 1116 00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:01,480 I have a country, 1117 00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,480 and then I guess it doesn't really matter. 1118 00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:07,480 Well, the research that has been done, 1119 00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:09,480 and there is a lot of research around this, 1120 00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:11,480 is that actually people find targeted 1121 00:42:11,480 --> 00:42:13,480 as much less annoying than general ads. 1122 00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:15,480 Because targeted ads actually have a chance 1123 00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:18,480 of meaning something to them and what Joe was suggesting, 1124 00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,480 which was the targeted content ad ads 1125 00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:22,480 would probably fit this as well. 1126 00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:26,480 But general ads that do not have anything to do with you 1127 00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:30,480 have no basis in your prior search history 1128 00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:33,480 or in the case of mobile ad tech in your prior installs 1129 00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:35,480 are actually considered much more annoying 1130 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:38,480 by most users than ads that actually 1131 00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:40,480 means something to them. 1132 00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:44,480 This is why when Apple introduced iOS 14, 1133 00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:46,480 they introduced this thing called the 1134 00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:49,480 SK ad network and with it 1135 00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:51,480 the sort of corollary privacy tools, 1136 00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:53,480 quote unquote, 1137 00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:57,480 which allows people to block the ad ad, 1138 00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:00,480 which is that string of numbers I was talking about. 1139 00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:02,480 Can I ask you a quick question since this is your jar, 1140 00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:04,480 or forget this question if I don't ask now. 1141 00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:06,480 Who's more valuable to you? 1142 00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:08,480 The average user or people, 1143 00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:10,480 I don't want to say like us, 1144 00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:11,480 but frankly like us, 1145 00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:15,480 who recognize that this is going on. 1146 00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:17,480 Everybody knows it's going on. 1147 00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:19,480 The most valuable people are... 1148 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:20,480 No. 1149 00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:23,480 There's no space book in shit. 1150 00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:25,480 Well, yeah, but here's the thing. 1151 00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:27,480 So, there are a few things. 1152 00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:29,480 There are classifications and if you've ever done 1153 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:32,480 any research into gaming apps you know this, 1154 00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:34,480 there are classifications people 1155 00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:36,480 that go all the way from basically 1156 00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:38,480 not payers to what they call whales. 1157 00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:40,480 There are a very small number of users 1158 00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:43,480 who are responsible for the vast majority of purchases. 1159 00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:47,480 The average user does not purchase things based on advertisements. 1160 00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:48,480 It just doesn't happen. 1161 00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:51,480 That's not what advertisers know this. 1162 00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:53,480 They're casting a very wide net. 1163 00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,480 They know that they're basically going to be in every 1164 00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,480 out of no 10,000 people they get. 1165 00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:01,480 There's actually only going to be maybe 15 who actually buy, 1166 00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:02,480 but they buy a lot. 1167 00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:04,480 There are people with a lot of disposable income. 1168 00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:07,480 But back to the point that was going on about the podcast, 1169 00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:11,480 the most valuable thing when it comes to advertising 1170 00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:14,480 and targeted advertising is not you. 1171 00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:16,480 It is not knowing about your previous actions. 1172 00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:18,480 It's not knowing about your previous behaviour. 1173 00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:20,480 It is your location. 1174 00:44:20,480 --> 00:44:21,480 Where are you currently? 1175 00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:24,480 Because that is what links this up 1176 00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:27,480 to different businesses that might have a chance 1177 00:44:27,480 --> 00:44:29,480 that's selling you something right now. 1178 00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:33,480 When you have apps that are asking for location access, 1179 00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:36,480 one of the big reasons for this is it's super important 1180 00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:38,480 that they know where you are right now 1181 00:44:38,480 --> 00:44:40,480 so that they can start recommending things to you. 1182 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:42,480 That's in the local area that you might go and buy. 1183 00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:45,480 That's how companies like mine get asked 1184 00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:48,480 to put ads in front of people who are nearby. 1185 00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:53,480 That's the most important thing in advertising. 1186 00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,480 Is it useless to tell? 1187 00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:59,480 Go back to your point. 1188 00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:02,480 If somebody in Indonesia has an ad, 1189 00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:05,480 why would they want me in the UK to hear that ad? 1190 00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:06,480 They don't. 1191 00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:08,480 It doesn't do anything for them. 1192 00:45:08,480 --> 00:45:09,480 It doesn't help them in any way. 1193 00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:15,480 Unless they have a online service 1194 00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:16,480 through it when they hear. 1195 00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:18,480 Unless they have some sort of service 1196 00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:21,480 that is online and can be purchased from anywhere. 1197 00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:23,480 Say a cloud provider. 1198 00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:24,480 For example. 1199 00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:25,480 Sure. 1200 00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:26,480 Are these things for you? 1201 00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:29,480 All of us just didn't say that radio. 1202 00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:31,480 Well, but I can really see this point. 1203 00:45:31,480 --> 00:45:33,480 But I mean, in this assistant radio, 1204 00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:34,480 there's a chat. 1205 00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:35,480 I've got a link to Sweden. 1206 00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:36,480 I don't want... 1207 00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:38,480 Oh, just the Swedish radio statement. 1208 00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:40,480 In fact, I might even go to Sweden. 1209 00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:41,480 Then I might be gay. 1210 00:45:41,480 --> 00:45:42,480 It wasn't there. 1211 00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:43,480 And I've probably been gay. 1212 00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:43,480 I've never been gay. 1213 00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:44,480 I've never been gay. 1214 00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:45,480 I've never been gay. 1215 00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:46,480 I've never been gay. 1216 00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:47,480 I've never been gay. 1217 00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:48,480 I've never been gay. 1218 00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:49,480 Whatever. 1219 00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:51,480 You've got more chance of saying something 1220 00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:53,480 if it's local, but it's a bit annoying 1221 00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:55,480 when you listen to something that's otherwise 1222 00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:57,480 and whatever. 1223 00:45:57,480 --> 00:45:59,480 You go, I don't know. 1224 00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:03,480 Advertisers don't care about what's annoying. 1225 00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:05,480 If they didn't, they wouldn't advertise. 1226 00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:06,480 Yeah. 1227 00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:08,480 They care about... 1228 00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,480 They care about ROI, return on investment. 1229 00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:12,480 Yeah, they care about ROI. 1230 00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:14,480 And is to your point, 1231 00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:16,480 where it says that they, 1232 00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:18,480 maybe I'll go to Sweden one day. 1233 00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:19,480 It doesn't matter. 1234 00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:20,480 That's one day. 1235 00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:21,480 That's not today. 1236 00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:22,480 That's not right now. 1237 00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:23,480 I want your money now. 1238 00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:24,480 That's advertisers. 1239 00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:27,480 Is there a way for the internet solar to target locations, 1240 00:46:27,480 --> 00:46:29,480 just like local sellers do? 1241 00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:32,480 And is there a way for them to determine which locations 1242 00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,480 are better and worse for them? 1243 00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:35,480 Are you into that yet? 1244 00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:36,480 Sure. 1245 00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:39,480 I mean, there is good research to indicate 1246 00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:41,480 when, you know, for example, 1247 00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:45,480 going to Joe's point about cloud resellers and stuff like that, 1248 00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:47,480 whereas it most useful to hear about that. 1249 00:46:47,480 --> 00:46:50,480 In other cities, London, New York, places like that, 1250 00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:52,480 where people are working for businesses, 1251 00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:55,480 where they're most likely to actually be working in an industry. 1252 00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:58,480 So, for example, you're going to get bombarded with that kind of thing in Silicon Valley, 1253 00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:00,480 but maybe less so in rural Yorkshire. 1254 00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:01,480 But there's no point. 1255 00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:03,480 So those are services, yes? 1256 00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:04,480 Sure. 1257 00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:04,480 Yeah. 1258 00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:05,480 Those are like cloud services. 1259 00:47:05,480 --> 00:47:06,480 AWS, for example. 1260 00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:08,480 How about... 1261 00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:10,480 And I'm not arguing with you. 1262 00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:11,480 I'm sorry. 1263 00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:12,480 This is really fascinating. 1264 00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:14,480 It's just spurring questions out of me. 1265 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:16,480 What about material goods? 1266 00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:18,480 If I want to sell... 1267 00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:20,480 I just bought a new little CNC machine, 1268 00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:21,480 and I think I'm doing good with it, 1269 00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:25,480 and I want to be able to sell CNC goods 1270 00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:27,480 to motorcycleists. 1271 00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:29,480 Sorry, that was predictable. 1272 00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:31,480 No, I think... 1273 00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:33,480 No paper. 1274 00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,480 You can advertise like this on the local 1275 00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:38,480 on that radio station, like podcast, whatever, 1276 00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:40,480 because you're not a company. 1277 00:47:40,480 --> 00:47:42,480 I think with the answer to that, 1278 00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:43,480 if you're just a person, 1279 00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:46,480 that's what you kind of get. 1280 00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:49,480 I mean, I'm talking specifically, 1281 00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:51,480 like, I don't know about radio advertising. 1282 00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:52,480 That's the only per few. 1283 00:47:52,480 --> 00:47:54,480 I just know about mobile advertising. 1284 00:47:54,480 --> 00:47:55,480 And to the point... 1285 00:47:55,480 --> 00:47:56,480 That was... 1286 00:47:56,480 --> 00:47:57,480 Yes, that is my question. 1287 00:47:57,480 --> 00:48:01,480 It is a serial advertising target that people... 1288 00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:02,480 No. 1289 00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:03,480 No. 1290 00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:04,480 No. 1291 00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:05,480 I'm stepping up on what I think... 1292 00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:06,480 Step up. 1293 00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:07,480 Say I want to... 1294 00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:09,480 I want to turn this from a hobby into a business, 1295 00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:11,480 or I want to turn this from a business 1296 00:48:11,480 --> 00:48:13,480 into a slightly larger business. 1297 00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:14,480 Can I still... 1298 00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:16,480 I'm asking specifically to sport. 1299 00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:18,480 If can I still find... 1300 00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:19,480 And I sell on the internet. 1301 00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:20,480 I'm not just a local guy. 1302 00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:21,480 I want to step it up from... 1303 00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:22,480 I do good locally. 1304 00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:24,480 I want to step it up. 1305 00:48:24,480 --> 00:48:26,480 My internet sales can... 1306 00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:28,480 Have you dabbled it? 1307 00:48:28,480 --> 00:48:31,480 I want to ask a specifically about your platform 1308 00:48:31,480 --> 00:48:32,480 that you work for. 1309 00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:34,480 I'm trying to frame it outside of that. 1310 00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:35,480 But can I... 1311 00:48:35,480 --> 00:48:38,480 Do you understand, as a guy who would explain it to me? 1312 00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:40,480 How a person... 1313 00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:43,480 In that scenario would target a podcast listener... 1314 00:48:43,480 --> 00:48:45,480 Physically on the globe. 1315 00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:48,480 So, just kind of outline what my business does. 1316 00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:49,480 We're in the... 1317 00:48:49,480 --> 00:48:51,480 We're in the sort of business of... 1318 00:48:51,480 --> 00:48:52,480 What's called... 1319 00:48:52,480 --> 00:48:54,480 It's called... 1320 00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:56,480 It's a mobile measurement. 1321 00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:57,480 What we do... 1322 00:48:57,480 --> 00:48:59,480 I'm a technical writer. 1323 00:48:59,480 --> 00:49:01,480 I don't get into the actual programming and it's a gritty. 1324 00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:05,480 But basically what we do is we attribute things like app installs 1325 00:49:05,480 --> 00:49:08,480 to the advertise that that succeeded in getting you to install it. 1326 00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:11,480 So, the stuff we're talking about specifically is apps. 1327 00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:13,480 But theoretically, from what you're talking about, 1328 00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:16,480 there are lots of different factors here. 1329 00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:20,480 Advertisers do collect large bases of information about... 1330 00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:23,480 Yes, you and your behavior as an individual. 1331 00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:25,480 But also, like I say, 1332 00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:28,480 the generalized information about the area you live in. 1333 00:49:28,480 --> 00:49:31,480 To take your example about motorcycle equipment. 1334 00:49:31,480 --> 00:49:35,480 If you happen to be in an area such as... 1335 00:49:35,480 --> 00:49:38,480 You are, let's say, you're in Wisconsin. 1336 00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:39,480 Okay? 1337 00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:41,480 You're in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. 1338 00:49:41,480 --> 00:49:42,480 And... 1339 00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:43,480 You probably did. 1340 00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:45,480 It's the home of Harley Davidson. 1341 00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:49,480 It's also, let's say, for example, it is currently the Harley Davidson festival. 1342 00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:54,480 There is a very good chance that because you're in that location at that time, 1343 00:49:54,480 --> 00:49:59,480 even if you yourself do not have a history of doing anything with motorcycles. 1344 00:49:59,480 --> 00:50:04,480 You are suddenly surrounded by a bunch of people who are involved with motorcycles 1345 00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:07,480 and are very, you know, we are talking thousands here. 1346 00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:09,480 So there's a big concentration there, 1347 00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:11,480 and they're basically going to catch a cast or net. 1348 00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:13,480 So say geographically, 1349 00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:17,480 I want to basically target this area for however long. 1350 00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:18,480 So it was a business. 1351 00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:19,480 So it was a business. 1352 00:50:19,480 --> 00:50:21,480 So the way that this would work for you is you... 1353 00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:22,480 It's a healthy capitalization. 1354 00:50:22,480 --> 00:50:23,480 It's geographic. 1355 00:50:23,480 --> 00:50:25,480 Yeah, there's loads of different... 1356 00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:27,480 This stuff is really complicated, 1357 00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:30,480 but the way it would work for you as a business owner now 1358 00:50:30,480 --> 00:50:32,480 is you would go to an advertiser and say, 1359 00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:36,480 I am going to give you basically this much money. 1360 00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:38,480 And I want you to put my ads in front of people 1361 00:50:38,480 --> 00:50:41,480 and the return on investment I want from that is this much in sales. 1362 00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:45,480 And the advertisers job to then use their body of knowledge 1363 00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:49,480 to put that ad in front of as many people as possible. 1364 00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:52,480 My software, for example, the software I work on, 1365 00:50:52,480 --> 00:50:54,480 if this were an app, for example, 1366 00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:56,480 you have an app and you want to advertise it. 1367 00:50:56,480 --> 00:51:00,480 The software that I work on would basically determine 1368 00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:03,480 who gets paid for the install. 1369 00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:07,480 So when a user clicks an ad and gets taken to the app store 1370 00:51:07,480 --> 00:51:09,480 to install that app, an advertiser needs to be paid. 1371 00:51:09,480 --> 00:51:11,480 Now you might have got three advertisers 1372 00:51:11,480 --> 00:51:13,480 advertising the app in the same way. 1373 00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:16,480 You need to know which one of them got that done. 1374 00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:19,480 And so basically advertisers are always vying 1375 00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:23,480 to be the one who got the install or to got the sale or whatever it was. 1376 00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:28,480 So they will use their vast knowledge of human behavior, 1377 00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:31,480 existing human behavior, existing user behavior, 1378 00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:36,480 but also yes, geography and patterns of behavior in a certain area 1379 00:51:36,480 --> 00:51:40,480 to target that ad where they're going to get the best ROI. 1380 00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:44,480 So yeah, it's one of those things. 1381 00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,480 I mean, it's sinister as a word for it. 1382 00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:53,480 Again, sinister implies I think a motivated person behind this 1383 00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:55,480 who is doing all of this. 1384 00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:58,480 But in reality, it's a bunch of dumb systems that know nothing 1385 00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:01,480 being strapped together. 1386 00:52:01,480 --> 00:52:05,480 And it's actually, like I say, you peek into one of these systems. 1387 00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:06,480 They don't know who you are. 1388 00:52:06,480 --> 00:52:07,480 They don't care. 1389 00:52:07,480 --> 00:52:10,480 They just know your, this UUID that's associated with your device, 1390 00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:12,480 not with you. 1391 00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:13,480 Sorry to interrupt. 1392 00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:15,480 Sorry to interrupt, man. 1393 00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:18,480 But I would love to talk to you about this properly, 1394 00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:21,480 when I'm not terribly drunk and on a shitty morgue 1395 00:52:21,480 --> 00:52:25,480 or connection in the wind. 1396 00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:27,480 So if just like at me somewhere or send me an email or something, 1397 00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:29,480 because I really want to talk to you in depth about this. 1398 00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:32,480 If you have time to an inclination to do so, 1399 00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:34,480 but I really would love to talk to you more about this. 1400 00:52:34,480 --> 00:52:38,480 Bad news is I've decided tonight he's a 120 pounds an hour. 1401 00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:40,480 It's sure. 1402 00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:46,480 Well, I do have those little dollars, you know. 1403 00:52:46,480 --> 00:52:49,480 I mean, like I say, I'm a technical writer, 1404 00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:52,480 and my job is really very perfunctory. 1405 00:52:52,480 --> 00:52:55,480 My job is basically to look at APIs and tell you how they work. 1406 00:52:55,480 --> 00:52:58,480 But we did, you've tried this to explain technology. 1407 00:52:58,480 --> 00:53:00,480 Your job is basically the same as mine. 1408 00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:02,480 But I talk and you write. 1409 00:53:02,480 --> 00:53:03,480 It's very similar. 1410 00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:04,480 Yeah. 1411 00:53:04,480 --> 00:53:06,480 It's just that I don't, I don't write about these, 1412 00:53:06,480 --> 00:53:07,480 sort of, you know, 1413 00:53:07,480 --> 00:53:10,480 I have a very limited purview of what I write about. 1414 00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:14,480 But we did do about three weeks of onboarding where we got this all explained to us. 1415 00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:18,480 And this industry is constantly evolving and my company is one of the ones at the forefront of it. 1416 00:53:18,480 --> 00:53:20,480 So, you know, they, they all, 1417 00:53:20,480 --> 00:53:22,480 That's why I want to talk to you. 1418 00:53:22,480 --> 00:53:23,480 To me. 1419 00:53:23,480 --> 00:53:25,480 That's why I want to talk to you. 1420 00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:28,480 To be totally fair, fair, sport. 1421 00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:32,480 I've asked you pretty much only marketing questions in your technical writer, 1422 00:53:32,480 --> 00:53:34,480 and there's not a lot of overlap there, 1423 00:53:34,480 --> 00:53:37,480 but really you've done a hero's job of it. 1424 00:53:37,480 --> 00:53:38,480 Yeah. 1425 00:53:38,480 --> 00:53:40,480 I mean, the great advantages. 1426 00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:42,480 We work with marketers specifically, 1427 00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:46,480 and they are the ones who come to us to ask us to implement new features to, 1428 00:53:46,480 --> 00:53:50,480 you know, handle these new upcoming features that they, 1429 00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:51,480 they really want to get in with. 1430 00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:57,480 But the best, the best people to talk to about this stuff would be the actual advertising agencies. 1431 00:53:57,480 --> 00:53:58,480 You know, it would be, 1432 00:53:58,480 --> 00:54:01,480 people that tell us about their own companies. 1433 00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:05,480 Our parent company is one call, I think it's an Apple oven or something. 1434 00:54:05,480 --> 00:54:11,480 And they are one of the market leaders in the actual tech behind advertising. 1435 00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:15,480 Like they're really, like, they're real big on this. 1436 00:54:15,480 --> 00:54:20,480 And it is worth looking into these different ad agencies and seeing how they do what they do. 1437 00:54:20,480 --> 00:54:25,480 Because they'd be good at explaining, at least in a sort of obfuscated way, 1438 00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:28,480 how they get your ads in front of people. 1439 00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:31,480 And it's fascinating. 1440 00:54:31,480 --> 00:54:34,480 So it really is a fascinating subject. 1441 00:54:34,480 --> 00:54:38,480 Like I say, I personally, if I were given the choice of working in mobile ad tech, 1442 00:54:38,480 --> 00:54:40,480 it wouldn't have been my choice. 1443 00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:43,480 But where I work is a very good company in terms of, 1444 00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:46,480 you can point, you're being employed there. They're very nice. 1445 00:54:46,480 --> 00:54:51,480 They're very, they were willing to take me on as a, as a writer when I had no previous experience with it. 1446 00:54:51,480 --> 00:54:52,480 So can't complain. 1447 00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:53,480 You have to go. 1448 00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:54,480 The office, so can you do it remote? 1449 00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:55,480 I am fully remote. 1450 00:54:55,480 --> 00:54:57,480 I do go into the office sometimes. 1451 00:54:57,480 --> 00:55:01,480 But now I live, I live, I'm like 45 minutes away. 1452 00:55:01,480 --> 00:55:03,480 So I don't bother much the time. 1453 00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:08,480 Can I, can I rotate the gem to see a different facet? 1454 00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:10,480 I don't want to actually transition. 1455 00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:14,480 Sorry, I'm talking like a podcaster. What kinds of advertising? 1456 00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:18,480 Because we haven't discussed, you know, direct payment of a podcast. 1457 00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:23,480 What other kinds of advertising are all of us willing to put up with? 1458 00:55:23,480 --> 00:55:30,480 If it's not this directed advertising that comes at you based on where you're standing when you download the podcast. 1459 00:55:30,480 --> 00:55:35,480 What else are you like just as an example, the live read, 1460 00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:38,480 or that's the only example I can think of. 1461 00:55:38,480 --> 00:55:41,480 I should not sit or I'm one good example. 1462 00:55:41,480 --> 00:55:45,480 This actually for me is there's a really good podcast called maintainable. 1463 00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:55,480 And maintainable is produced by a company and the only advertising they do is for themselves. 1464 00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:58,480 So basically they use it as a vehicle to advertise themselves. 1465 00:55:58,480 --> 00:56:00,480 And I mean, I will never use their services. 1466 00:56:00,480 --> 00:56:05,480 They, they work as a specifically Ruby on Rails consultancy firm, 1467 00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:09,480 which is not a software product I use or or something I would have need. 1468 00:56:09,480 --> 00:56:14,480 But I appreciate that advertising firm for Ruby on Rails consultancy. 1469 00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:15,480 Well, sure. Yeah. 1470 00:56:15,480 --> 00:56:19,480 Well, another example of that is thinking elixir, 1471 00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:24,480 which is a very, very specific podcast about elixir, 1472 00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:28,480 the programming language, which is a cart remember what it's derived from. 1473 00:56:28,480 --> 00:56:29,480 I'm sure someone will tell me right now. 1474 00:56:29,480 --> 00:56:31,480 And that's sponsored by, 1475 00:56:31,480 --> 00:56:35,480 oh, there are some big company in the elixir world anyway. 1476 00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:38,480 And that's their whole thing is to just advertise themselves. 1477 00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:43,480 And they pay an editor and all rest of it to produce a professional sounding podcast. 1478 00:56:43,480 --> 00:56:45,480 That's that's one route to go down. 1479 00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:48,480 And you know, it's something I've explored as well. 1480 00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:52,480 And people, you know, I've had meetings with people and got close and done pilots. 1481 00:56:52,480 --> 00:56:58,480 And and well, for a while kind of did that for a living for 18 months in a way. 1482 00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:04,480 So can I ask other than then Joe and Spore of the other people in the room who were listening. 1483 00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:10,480 Would you listen to a podcast like that that just puts on basically, 1484 00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:13,480 I mean, it sounds like propaganda to me. 1485 00:57:13,480 --> 00:57:17,480 It sounds like self hosted self circling propaganda. 1486 00:57:17,480 --> 00:57:19,480 Anybody else in the room, what do you think? 1487 00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:26,480 Well, I know that we have upwards of a thousand people listening to Distrohopper Digest. 1488 00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:33,480 So I really don't see how we couldn't have a niche podcast for the people that wanted to listen to a niche podcast. 1489 00:57:33,480 --> 00:57:35,480 Yeah, but I'm not asking about niche podcast. 1490 00:57:35,480 --> 00:57:42,480 I'm asking like your your bread and butter stuff or even finish your niche podcast. 1491 00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:45,480 The guy making it says, hey, I can't afford to do this anymore. 1492 00:57:45,480 --> 00:57:49,480 If I don't start getting some money coming in, what are you willing to put up with? 1493 00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:55,480 What would you prefer to have presented to you as his or her monetization? 1494 00:57:55,480 --> 00:57:58,480 Plan. 1495 00:57:58,480 --> 00:58:01,480 My first preference is donations. 1496 00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:06,480 If we do go to ads, we want it to be ads that we support that we use. 1497 00:58:06,480 --> 00:58:11,480 Not something that just happens beyond the topic. 1498 00:58:11,480 --> 00:58:14,480 But it's really not my friend. 1499 00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:17,480 Yeah, I'm really on the fringe of this. 1500 00:58:17,480 --> 00:58:22,480 I've taken heat for promoting my podcast as being ad free. 1501 00:58:22,480 --> 00:58:27,480 Indeed, we've clashed about it and I've knocked you pretty much everywhere I can think of because of it. 1502 00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:35,480 Because you have publicly said, you've probably talked about advertising as being like a really negative thing. 1503 00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:37,480 And you know, you're entitled to a opinion. 1504 00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:40,480 No, I'm not talking about talking about you from my. 1505 00:58:40,480 --> 00:58:43,480 I am not my current advertising as a negative thing. 1506 00:58:43,480 --> 00:58:49,480 I'm referring to most of my listeners seeing it as a negative thing and me not needing advertising money. 1507 00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:52,480 So it's a promotional thing. 1508 00:58:52,480 --> 00:58:59,480 If you want to reach people that don't want to hear advertising in a podcast, you have to promote that you don't have advertising in your podcast. 1509 00:58:59,480 --> 00:59:00,480 I guess so. 1510 00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:03,480 But you know, if you just want to do something as a hobby, then good luck. 1511 00:59:03,480 --> 00:59:06,480 But you know, I did this for a living man. 1512 00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:08,480 So I'm not going to do down for what you do. 1513 00:59:08,480 --> 00:59:12,480 And I don't think you should be putting down me down for what I do. 1514 00:59:12,480 --> 00:59:14,480 Yeah, for Joe. 1515 00:59:14,480 --> 00:59:19,480 And I'm touching. I am loyal who's not here at the moment. 1516 00:59:19,480 --> 00:59:21,480 We do a podcast together. We don't take ads. 1517 00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:27,480 We never want to take ads. If it gets to the point where that if we need to take advertisements or to collect money, 1518 00:59:27,480 --> 00:59:34,480 we kind of decided as a group that we don't want to continue the podcast at that point. 1519 00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:42,480 So I mean, thank God for free software podcasting is is monetarily cheap enough that we've been able to continue doing this. 1520 00:59:42,480 --> 00:59:44,480 I mean, it's hard and wild. 1521 00:59:44,480 --> 00:59:46,480 Do it and allow me to tag along. 1522 00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:48,480 Hi, Taj. Have a new year. 1523 00:59:48,480 --> 00:59:49,480 Happy new year. 1524 00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:56,480 Yeah, totally. Like if you just want to do it as a hobby, then yeah, thanks to free and open software and various other services. 1525 00:59:56,480 --> 01:00:02,480 You can do it pretty much completely for free at this point and not even need any donations. 1526 01:00:02,480 --> 01:00:04,480 Maybe like a domain. 1527 01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:10,480 If you want to splash out 10 bucks a year or 20 bucks for one of those fancy domains. 1528 01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:15,480 And otherwise, yeah, it can be completely free. But that's just not what I went into this thinking. 1529 01:00:15,480 --> 01:00:20,480 I went into this thinking that I want to make podcasts about Linux and open source, not shit. 1530 01:00:20,480 --> 01:00:23,480 Like they were when I came into this nearly 10 years ago. 1531 01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:26,480 And I want to try and raise the quality. 1532 01:00:26,480 --> 01:00:30,480 And I want to make people actually do good shows. 1533 01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:33,480 And the only way I can do that is by doing that myself. 1534 01:00:33,480 --> 01:00:38,480 And so I spent a long time getting good at making shows about Linux. 1535 01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:44,480 And the only way I can do that is by getting paid to do it because I'm not just going to do it totally for free. 1536 01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:50,480 And so I made it my job and now it is my job and when some people come along and say, well, 1537 01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:58,480 Well, when people come into my social channels like my telegram group and start advertising their podcast as being we've got no adverse. 1538 01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:02,480 So we're better or we're great because we've got no adverse like 1539 01:01:02,480 --> 01:01:08,480 I'm not ever saying we're better because we have no adverse. 1540 01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:10,480 I'm just saying we have no adverse. 1541 01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:13,480 You have an attitude about this that I don't have. 1542 01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:18,480 And I don't understand why you're upset with me for promoting my product the way it is. 1543 01:01:18,480 --> 01:01:23,480 This debate sounds way older than the however many of us sitting down tonight. 1544 01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:24,480 It is way older. 1545 01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:27,480 And I very nearly left when I realized it was here. 1546 01:01:27,480 --> 01:01:32,480 And then he started talking about it in the chat and and riled me up a little bit. 1547 01:01:32,480 --> 01:01:36,480 And I'm really trying not to to get angry and leave. 1548 01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:38,480 But I think I might have to because I just. 1549 01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:40,480 Well, no, please don't agree with this. 1550 01:01:40,480 --> 01:01:43,480 Well, you don't have to leave because you're doing a disagree with somebody. 1551 01:01:43,480 --> 01:01:44,480 That's what's wrong with the world today. 1552 01:01:44,480 --> 01:01:48,480 Just learn to communicate with this. 1553 01:01:48,480 --> 01:01:50,480 Let's communicate with people. 1554 01:01:50,480 --> 01:01:53,480 Like it is literally my job is not about communicating with people. 1555 01:01:53,480 --> 01:01:57,480 Sometimes you just have to accept that some people can't be communicated with man. 1556 01:01:57,480 --> 01:01:59,480 And you have to just block them. 1557 01:01:59,480 --> 01:02:02,480 And you know, once you get to a certain. 1558 01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:03,480 I don't want to chat. 1559 01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:07,480 I'm saying there's like at least 10, 12 other people in the room right now. 1560 01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:10,480 And you're saying you need to think things that we're interested in. 1561 01:02:10,480 --> 01:02:13,480 And so is Zavalia saying interesting things. 1562 01:02:13,480 --> 01:02:14,480 So I don't know. 1563 01:02:14,480 --> 01:02:16,480 I guess I'm just asking you for my own. 1564 01:02:16,480 --> 01:02:21,480 I've been a faction just stick around and just we're having a conversation. 1565 01:02:21,480 --> 01:02:23,480 I've got questions for you. 1566 01:02:23,480 --> 01:02:26,480 You've said stuff that's that's prompted questions in my head. 1567 01:02:26,480 --> 01:02:29,480 Having nothing to do with Zavalia. 1568 01:02:29,480 --> 01:02:30,480 Can we put a zival moment? 1569 01:02:30,480 --> 01:02:31,480 Zavalia. 1570 01:02:31,480 --> 01:02:32,480 What does Zavalia? 1571 01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:34,480 I say don't problem with Joe. 1572 01:02:34,480 --> 01:02:35,480 Joe has a problem with me. 1573 01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:36,480 I don't understand it. 1574 01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:37,480 I'm trying to decide. 1575 01:02:37,480 --> 01:02:38,480 Can you put aside? 1576 01:02:38,480 --> 01:02:39,480 Can you put aside? 1577 01:02:39,480 --> 01:02:40,480 I can't do it. 1578 01:02:40,480 --> 01:02:41,480 I can do it. 1579 01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:41,480 I can do it. 1580 01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:41,480 I can do it. 1581 01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:42,480 And all together. 1582 01:02:42,480 --> 01:02:42,480 Yeah. 1583 01:02:42,480 --> 01:02:45,480 Just if he shuts up and just stops talking. 1584 01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:46,480 And then we can put it aside. 1585 01:02:46,480 --> 01:02:47,480 No problem. 1586 01:02:47,480 --> 01:02:48,480 And I'll keep talking to the rest of you. 1587 01:02:48,480 --> 01:02:49,480 No problem. 1588 01:02:49,480 --> 01:02:50,480 Yeah. 1589 01:02:50,480 --> 01:02:52,480 But if he's going to keep buttoning in, I'm going to leave. 1590 01:02:52,480 --> 01:02:53,480 It's as simple as that. 1591 01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:54,480 I've no time for the fellow. 1592 01:02:54,480 --> 01:02:56,480 So it's a great dream drama. 1593 01:02:56,480 --> 01:02:57,480 It's an open room. 1594 01:02:57,480 --> 01:03:00,480 But you're open to join and you're open to leave. 1595 01:03:00,480 --> 01:03:02,480 And if you keep talking, I'm going to leave. 1596 01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:03,480 It's as simple as that. 1597 01:03:03,480 --> 01:03:05,480 You're all to open to chase somebody out of the room. 1598 01:03:05,480 --> 01:03:06,480 And if you want to be obnoxious. 1599 01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:08,480 I did that to somebody one time. 1600 01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:10,480 And I still haven't been given myself. 1601 01:03:10,480 --> 01:03:12,480 And he probably hasn't forgiven me for it. 1602 01:03:12,480 --> 01:03:14,480 I don't want to be obnoxious. 1603 01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:17,480 And you're being hurt as being obnoxious. 1604 01:03:17,480 --> 01:03:19,480 And I'm not only like him. 1605 01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:21,480 Only just just chill out when he's part of it. 1606 01:03:21,480 --> 01:03:22,480 Oh, yeah. 1607 01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:23,480 I'm in the lead after another day. 1608 01:03:23,480 --> 01:03:24,480 That's all I'm asking. 1609 01:03:24,480 --> 01:03:25,480 Okay. 1610 01:03:25,480 --> 01:03:26,480 I can leave it. 1611 01:03:26,480 --> 01:03:27,480 Sorry. 1612 01:03:27,480 --> 01:03:28,480 I was a way while listening to a bit. 1613 01:03:28,480 --> 01:03:31,480 And I see there's a heat struggling or some sort of habit. 1614 01:03:31,480 --> 01:03:32,480 Can I be the. 1615 01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:34,480 Well, I don't know the piece. 1616 01:03:34,480 --> 01:03:39,480 But I want to ask a question to Joe actually going with what he's saying. 1617 01:03:39,480 --> 01:03:46,480 Just now about podcasting and how he decided that he was going to be a bit different. 1618 01:03:46,480 --> 01:03:48,480 Ten years ago, they weren't particularly good or whatever. 1619 01:03:48,480 --> 01:03:53,480 So it sounds like Joe is getting some making some money doing podcasting. 1620 01:03:53,480 --> 01:03:55,480 It's what I do for a living. 1621 01:03:55,480 --> 01:03:56,480 Yes. 1622 01:03:56,480 --> 01:03:57,480 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 1623 01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:00,480 And I think I talked to you briefly before now. 1624 01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:02,480 You want the podcast people. 1625 01:04:02,480 --> 01:04:04,480 But it might might be not. 1626 01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:05,480 I'll count with you. 1627 01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:06,480 I'm not sure. 1628 01:04:06,480 --> 01:04:11,480 You're going up on there anyway. 1629 01:04:11,480 --> 01:04:13,480 It on HBO at some stage. 1630 01:04:13,480 --> 01:04:15,480 And this might actually be a good time. 1631 01:04:15,480 --> 01:04:18,480 So I can word this right. 1632 01:04:18,480 --> 01:04:22,480 Basically, is it as open source a pastime hobby? 1633 01:04:22,480 --> 01:04:23,480 Or is it a job? 1634 01:04:23,480 --> 01:04:27,480 And what I mean is like, so I know that a lot of open source stuff is voluntary. 1635 01:04:27,480 --> 01:04:28,480 It's hobbyist. 1636 01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:30,480 It's it's done for fun. 1637 01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:33,480 But then some things are done as a pastime. 1638 01:04:33,480 --> 01:04:36,480 And then the question can be, are you a professional model? 1639 01:04:36,480 --> 01:04:40,480 So in your case, are you a professional podcast or would you say now? 1640 01:04:40,480 --> 01:04:45,480 If you see my question when I'm trying to ask, I don't know if it makes sense. 1641 01:04:45,480 --> 01:04:48,480 I think I can understand. 1642 01:04:48,480 --> 01:04:50,480 Because you're interested. 1643 01:04:50,480 --> 01:04:52,480 So just the hobby. 1644 01:04:52,480 --> 01:04:53,480 Yes. 1645 01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:54,480 Okay. 1646 01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:58,480 So to be clear, my only source of income is making podcasts. 1647 01:04:58,480 --> 01:04:59,480 Yeah. 1648 01:04:59,480 --> 01:05:01,480 They are almost all about that. 1649 01:05:01,480 --> 01:05:02,480 Hold on. 1650 01:05:02,480 --> 01:05:06,480 Seb, you really can't key up when anybody else is keyed up. 1651 01:05:06,480 --> 01:05:07,480 Instantly causes. 1652 01:05:07,480 --> 01:05:11,480 Yeah. 1653 01:05:11,480 --> 01:05:12,480 Yeah. 1654 01:05:12,480 --> 01:05:15,480 It makes Joe and anybody else unintelligible. 1655 01:05:15,480 --> 01:05:16,480 Sorry, Joe. 1656 01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:18,480 No, the alcohol makes me unintelligible. 1657 01:05:18,480 --> 01:05:19,480 No. 1658 01:05:19,480 --> 01:05:21,480 It makes you looser in the lips that I love it. 1659 01:05:21,480 --> 01:05:23,480 It's wiggling my hips. 1660 01:05:23,480 --> 01:05:27,480 It makes me almost say a word that gets me fired from certain jobs. 1661 01:05:27,480 --> 01:05:28,480 So anyway. 1662 01:05:28,480 --> 01:05:29,480 So right. 1663 01:05:29,480 --> 01:05:30,480 Yes. 1664 01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:33,480 Why do to be clear to everyone who doesn't know who I am? 1665 01:05:33,480 --> 01:05:36,480 What I do for a living is make podcasts about Linux. 1666 01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:40,480 So basically the joke is I talked to my friends about Linux for a living. 1667 01:05:40,480 --> 01:05:45,480 So basically what everyone has been doing here tonight and for the last like 50 something 1668 01:05:45,480 --> 01:05:48,480 hours I think or whatever long this has been going in it. 1669 01:05:48,480 --> 01:05:51,480 Anyway, that's the joke is that's what I do for a living. 1670 01:05:51,480 --> 01:05:56,480 But in reality, what I do is I craft those that are entertaining and amusing and informative 1671 01:05:56,480 --> 01:06:02,480 and thought-provoking and not too long, not too short and whatever. 1672 01:06:02,480 --> 01:06:06,480 And I also have to sell a bunch of ads and I have to deal with the finances of that. 1673 01:06:06,480 --> 01:06:11,480 And I have to be a terrible, terrible, this admin in a sense as well. 1674 01:06:11,480 --> 01:06:15,480 So yeah, that's what I do for a living is make shows about Linux. 1675 01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:23,480 And the question about this idea of open source being a hobbyist and ever versus a professional and ever. 1676 01:06:23,480 --> 01:06:27,480 There are two types of people who contribute to open source. 1677 01:06:27,480 --> 01:06:31,480 There are people who do it in their spare time and there are people who do it for a living. 1678 01:06:31,480 --> 01:06:35,480 And that vendor diagram is not two separate circles. 1679 01:06:35,480 --> 01:06:41,480 There are often people who contribute to open source projects for a company like Red Hat, 1680 01:06:41,480 --> 01:06:46,480 let's say, or Chronicle, or Sousa, whoever owns them this week. 1681 01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:48,480 Yep, I've been around a while. 1682 01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:50,480 It's not even circles, dude. 1683 01:06:50,480 --> 01:06:53,480 They overlap in weird non-uclidean ways. 1684 01:06:53,480 --> 01:06:57,480 Well, yeah, I was simplifying, obviously. 1685 01:06:57,480 --> 01:07:07,480 What I'm saying is this, that to be an open source person does not necessarily mean that you are paid all the time or 1686 01:07:07,480 --> 01:07:09,480 a volunteer all the time. 1687 01:07:09,480 --> 01:07:15,480 There's overlap, but there's a myth that open source software is all volunteers. 1688 01:07:15,480 --> 01:07:20,480 And the reality of that is so far from that. 1689 01:07:20,480 --> 01:07:25,480 Most people who work on open source software get paid to do so. 1690 01:07:25,480 --> 01:07:33,480 And, you know, you could argue that, well, most open source software only has one person who 1691 01:07:33,480 --> 01:07:38,480 develops it and maintains it on some GitHub or GitHub or whatever repository. 1692 01:07:38,480 --> 01:07:43,480 But I'm talking about the open source software that millions of people actually use. 1693 01:07:43,480 --> 01:07:45,480 Put your hands away. 1694 01:07:45,480 --> 01:07:50,480 Even if it is just that one person, that one person still has to sustain themselves 1695 01:07:50,480 --> 01:07:53,480 day to day, week to week, year to year. 1696 01:07:53,480 --> 01:07:56,480 Yeah, and so the best way to do that is to get a company to pay. 1697 01:07:56,480 --> 01:08:00,480 Well, to get your thing popular enough that a company will pay you to work on it. 1698 01:08:00,480 --> 01:08:08,480 Because they are depending on it and they realise that it's not a good idea to depend on something that someone's doing in their evenings and weekends. 1699 01:08:08,480 --> 01:08:10,480 But that's like a whole other debate. 1700 01:08:10,480 --> 01:08:15,480 But the best way of doing it or that that's the only way, 1701 01:08:15,480 --> 01:08:22,480 because the best I can see that is being like a incendiary word in the rest of a completely agreeable sense. 1702 01:08:22,480 --> 01:08:26,480 It's a complicated issue. 1703 01:08:26,480 --> 01:08:33,480 The funding of open source is not something we can tackle in 50 hours, 1704 01:08:33,480 --> 01:08:36,480 500 hours of discussion on mumble. 1705 01:08:36,480 --> 01:08:38,480 We can't even solve this project, I'll go home. 1706 01:08:38,480 --> 01:08:39,480 No. 1707 01:08:39,480 --> 01:08:42,480 We can have a hundred new year. 1708 01:08:42,480 --> 01:08:49,480 HVR things and still not come up with a solution to the problem of funding or software. 1709 01:08:49,480 --> 01:08:53,480 But all I'm saying is this, my business model is pretty straightforward, right? 1710 01:08:53,480 --> 01:08:57,480 I make great shows that a bunch of people listen to, 1711 01:08:57,480 --> 01:09:02,480 and then I sell as many ads as I can that are based on the content 1712 01:09:02,480 --> 01:09:08,480 and offer people the opportunity to listen to those shows without any adverts 1713 01:09:08,480 --> 01:09:11,480 if they're willing to pay a certain number of dollars per month. 1714 01:09:11,480 --> 01:09:14,480 It's a relatively straightforward business model. 1715 01:09:14,480 --> 01:09:16,480 It doesn't involve any tracking as such. 1716 01:09:16,480 --> 01:09:19,480 It just involves a tracking of how many people are downloading. 1717 01:09:19,480 --> 01:09:21,480 How many thousand people listen to that episode? 1718 01:09:21,480 --> 01:09:23,480 That's all I'm really interested in. 1719 01:09:23,480 --> 01:09:25,480 To some extent, what country are you in, 1720 01:09:25,480 --> 01:09:28,480 but that's as granular as it gets? 1721 01:09:28,480 --> 01:09:30,480 What's the demographics? 1722 01:09:30,480 --> 01:09:36,480 Well, I don't need tracking software to tell me that it's 20 to 50-year-old white men 1723 01:09:36,480 --> 01:09:37,480 who listen to my shows. 1724 01:09:37,480 --> 01:09:40,480 I just have to go to any event that I organise, 1725 01:09:40,480 --> 01:09:43,480 and that fucking tells me who's listening to my shows. 1726 01:09:43,480 --> 01:09:46,480 So, okay, in that case, my question is, 1727 01:09:46,480 --> 01:09:48,480 you would say you are, well, two questions a day. 1728 01:09:48,480 --> 01:09:51,480 One is, you would say you are professional podcast, yes. 1729 01:09:51,480 --> 01:09:52,480 But what do you do? 1730 01:09:52,480 --> 01:09:54,480 So, that makes you, you're not into the hobbyist. 1731 01:09:54,480 --> 01:09:56,480 That's the first question, yes. 1732 01:09:56,480 --> 01:09:58,480 Well, I make a living out of it. 1733 01:09:58,480 --> 01:10:00,480 Whether that makes me professional or not, 1734 01:10:00,480 --> 01:10:02,480 is a matter of humor, but yes, 1735 01:10:02,480 --> 01:10:06,480 I am a professional podcast right now at this time. 1736 01:10:06,480 --> 01:10:08,480 On the first of January, 2023, 1737 01:10:08,480 --> 01:10:12,480 that is currently my profession is making podcasts, yes. 1738 01:10:12,480 --> 01:10:13,480 Yes, yes. 1739 01:10:13,480 --> 01:10:15,480 That's going to take that as an answer. 1740 01:10:15,480 --> 01:10:18,480 And also, the whole thing that does the debate, 1741 01:10:18,480 --> 01:10:22,480 and that's, I kind of want to talk about that in this public speaking, 1742 01:10:22,480 --> 01:10:24,480 and speak to them, thinking of doing a march, 1743 01:10:24,480 --> 01:10:26,480 and probably speaking group for seven minutes, 1744 01:10:26,480 --> 01:10:28,480 but there are some people, you know, 1745 01:10:28,480 --> 01:10:31,480 the steam people, so I can do it in my open source. 1746 01:10:31,480 --> 01:10:34,480 They just basically have so much of their free time, 1747 01:10:34,480 --> 01:10:36,480 the hobbyists, that's their big, 1748 01:10:36,480 --> 01:10:38,480 that's what they do in this fair time, 1749 01:10:38,480 --> 01:10:40,480 not even getting paid for it. 1750 01:10:40,480 --> 01:10:43,480 I think what people overlook is that people think, 1751 01:10:43,480 --> 01:10:45,480 hey, you're not doing anything that good, 1752 01:10:45,480 --> 01:10:47,480 and that's what you get in paid, 1753 01:10:47,480 --> 01:10:48,480 but that's like, hang on a minute, 1754 01:10:48,480 --> 01:10:51,480 there's loads of open source contributions 1755 01:10:51,480 --> 01:10:54,480 that are absolutely amazing that people do from programming, 1756 01:10:54,480 --> 01:10:57,480 to caught testing, to translation, 1757 01:10:57,480 --> 01:10:59,480 to documentation, to quality shorts, 1758 01:10:59,480 --> 01:11:00,480 and they're not getting paid, 1759 01:11:00,480 --> 01:11:02,480 but I think there's some really amazing things, 1760 01:11:02,480 --> 01:11:04,480 some great, really poor, great projects, 1761 01:11:04,480 --> 01:11:06,480 come to the community now, 1762 01:11:06,480 --> 01:11:08,480 have an example, not just that, 1763 01:11:08,480 --> 01:11:11,480 and I think that's the point I want to try and make, 1764 01:11:11,480 --> 01:11:14,480 somewhere that people can do some really amazing things, 1765 01:11:14,480 --> 01:11:16,480 an open source is one way to do it, 1766 01:11:16,480 --> 01:11:19,480 because it allows you to do whatever you want pretty much, 1767 01:11:19,480 --> 01:11:21,480 and you don't have to be paid, 1768 01:11:21,480 --> 01:11:24,480 but there are people getting paid as well doing things, 1769 01:11:24,480 --> 01:11:26,480 it's been a bit of both. 1770 01:11:26,480 --> 01:11:29,480 I just like to put in here, 1771 01:11:29,480 --> 01:11:33,480 because I'm an open source maintainer in my spare time. 1772 01:11:33,480 --> 01:11:37,480 The software is the smallest parts, 1773 01:11:37,480 --> 01:11:40,480 of many open source projects, 1774 01:11:40,480 --> 01:11:43,480 and actually the writing of the software 1775 01:11:43,480 --> 01:11:46,480 often is what you spend the least amount of time doing, 1776 01:11:46,480 --> 01:11:49,480 and you say, you know, you can do what you want with it. 1777 01:11:49,480 --> 01:11:50,480 It's not really true, 1778 01:11:50,480 --> 01:11:52,480 at the moment you start getting users, 1779 01:11:52,480 --> 01:11:55,480 they start to dictate how, 1780 01:11:55,480 --> 01:11:58,480 and not dictate in like a dictatorship sort of way, 1781 01:11:58,480 --> 01:12:01,480 but they start to influence very heavily 1782 01:12:01,480 --> 01:12:04,480 how you build the software going forward, 1783 01:12:04,480 --> 01:12:07,480 and that can lead to you having to put a lot of time 1784 01:12:07,480 --> 01:12:09,480 into things you never really wanted to. 1785 01:12:09,480 --> 01:12:10,480 You have no interest in, 1786 01:12:10,480 --> 01:12:13,480 you have to put a lot of time into research, 1787 01:12:13,480 --> 01:12:15,480 and understanding, and, you know, 1788 01:12:15,480 --> 01:12:16,480 conversation. 1789 01:12:16,480 --> 01:12:17,480 So in that way, 1790 01:12:17,480 --> 01:12:19,480 it's kind of similar to what Joe was saying, 1791 01:12:19,480 --> 01:12:20,480 where it's like, 1792 01:12:20,480 --> 01:12:23,480 a podcast is not just, you know, 1793 01:12:23,480 --> 01:12:25,480 recording yourself talking. 1794 01:12:25,480 --> 01:12:27,480 There's a lot of behind-the-scenes stuff, 1795 01:12:27,480 --> 01:12:31,480 and that's actually where the money tends to go. 1796 01:12:31,480 --> 01:12:34,480 So we've had, you know, we've had, 1797 01:12:34,480 --> 01:12:35,480 we've been very lucky in the past. 1798 01:12:35,480 --> 01:12:36,480 We've had some funding, 1799 01:12:36,480 --> 01:12:38,480 and the vast majority of it seems to go on, 1800 01:12:38,480 --> 01:12:40,480 just keeping the project managed. 1801 01:12:40,480 --> 01:12:43,480 Very little of it actually goes on the code, 1802 01:12:43,480 --> 01:12:44,480 to get written. 1803 01:12:44,480 --> 01:12:46,480 It's the stuff around the code. 1804 01:12:46,480 --> 01:12:48,480 It's the talking to people, 1805 01:12:48,480 --> 01:12:49,480 it's the research, 1806 01:12:49,480 --> 01:12:50,480 it's the planning, 1807 01:12:50,480 --> 01:12:53,480 it's the sort of, 1808 01:12:53,480 --> 01:12:55,480 continued sort of conversations with people, 1809 01:12:55,480 --> 01:12:57,480 that's where it gets really, 1810 01:12:57,480 --> 01:12:59,480 expensive and challenging. 1811 01:12:59,480 --> 01:13:01,480 I think, you know, 1812 01:13:01,480 --> 01:13:01,480 consoles. 1813 01:13:01,480 --> 01:13:02,480 Yeah, I mean, 1814 01:13:02,480 --> 01:13:04,480 I think marketing depends on the project, 1815 01:13:04,480 --> 01:13:05,480 obviously, again, 1816 01:13:05,480 --> 01:13:08,480 but I do think marketing is a barrier 1817 01:13:08,480 --> 01:13:11,480 that a lot of projects will have 1818 01:13:11,480 --> 01:13:13,480 proper struggle with, 1819 01:13:13,480 --> 01:13:14,480 or they will be hard to do, 1820 01:13:14,480 --> 01:13:16,480 but marketing is kind of, 1821 01:13:16,480 --> 01:13:17,480 it's important, 1822 01:13:17,480 --> 01:13:18,480 or you're not going to get the users, 1823 01:13:18,480 --> 01:13:20,480 and then who's going to be using this stuff anyway. 1824 01:13:20,480 --> 01:13:21,480 Yeah, 1825 01:13:21,480 --> 01:13:24,480 marketing is an interesting, 1826 01:13:24,480 --> 01:13:27,480 an interesting conundrum for, 1827 01:13:27,480 --> 01:13:29,480 you know, open source projects, 1828 01:13:29,480 --> 01:13:30,480 and particularly, 1829 01:13:30,480 --> 01:13:31,480 I mean, 1830 01:13:31,480 --> 01:13:33,480 we've had a particular problem recently, 1831 01:13:33,480 --> 01:13:33,480 of course, 1832 01:13:33,480 --> 01:13:35,480 this whole Twitter debacle went on, 1833 01:13:35,480 --> 01:13:36,480 and people came over from Twitter, 1834 01:13:36,480 --> 01:13:37,480 to master them. 1835 01:13:37,480 --> 01:13:37,480 Now, 1836 01:13:37,480 --> 01:13:38,480 master it on, 1837 01:13:38,480 --> 01:13:40,480 occupies a similar space to us. 1838 01:13:40,480 --> 01:13:41,480 We're all, 1839 01:13:41,480 --> 01:13:42,480 we're both a federal, 1840 01:13:42,480 --> 01:13:44,480 federal project. 1841 01:13:44,480 --> 01:13:45,480 And so, 1842 01:13:45,480 --> 01:13:47,480 we were really sort of excited 1843 01:13:47,480 --> 01:13:51,480 that people would come over to, 1844 01:13:51,480 --> 01:13:52,480 you know, 1845 01:13:52,480 --> 01:13:53,480 to Funkwell, 1846 01:13:53,480 --> 01:13:54,480 check it out. 1847 01:13:54,480 --> 01:13:55,480 But of course, 1848 01:13:55,480 --> 01:13:56,480 because the, 1849 01:13:56,480 --> 01:13:57,480 the software was kind of in a, 1850 01:13:57,480 --> 01:13:58,480 it's kind of in a, 1851 01:13:58,480 --> 01:14:00,480 a state to the moment of in-betweenness, 1852 01:14:00,480 --> 01:14:03,480 their first impression of it was, 1853 01:14:03,480 --> 01:14:04,480 I don't understand, 1854 01:14:04,480 --> 01:14:05,480 it's confusing, 1855 01:14:05,480 --> 01:14:06,480 it's ugly, 1856 01:14:06,480 --> 01:14:07,480 and all this stuff, 1857 01:14:07,480 --> 01:14:08,480 and so we actually ended up getting 1858 01:14:08,480 --> 01:14:10,480 bad press from people coming over, 1859 01:14:10,480 --> 01:14:12,480 in light of what happened at Twitter, 1860 01:14:12,480 --> 01:14:13,480 and that's, 1861 01:14:13,480 --> 01:14:15,480 that's a really challenging to do, 1862 01:14:15,480 --> 01:14:16,480 because, 1863 01:14:16,480 --> 01:14:17,480 you know, 1864 01:14:17,480 --> 01:14:19,480 we can't show them the results of all the work 1865 01:14:19,480 --> 01:14:21,480 that we've done until it's finished, 1866 01:14:21,480 --> 01:14:22,480 and that I think is actually a, 1867 01:14:22,480 --> 01:14:24,480 a lot of open source projects, 1868 01:14:24,480 --> 01:14:25,480 sort of hit, 1869 01:14:25,480 --> 01:14:27,480 is that they get attention at the 1870 01:14:27,480 --> 01:14:28,480 wrong time, 1871 01:14:28,480 --> 01:14:29,480 and that can be just as bad as 1872 01:14:29,480 --> 01:14:30,480 not getting attention at all. 1873 01:14:30,480 --> 01:14:31,480 Maybe, 1874 01:14:31,480 --> 01:14:32,480 I don't, 1875 01:14:32,480 --> 01:14:34,480 I don't know if MasterDone 1876 01:14:34,480 --> 01:14:36,480 was ready to take on those people, 1877 01:14:36,480 --> 01:14:37,480 like the servers, 1878 01:14:37,480 --> 01:14:38,480 but suddenly there's a massive 1879 01:14:38,480 --> 01:14:39,480 in-look, 1880 01:14:39,480 --> 01:14:40,480 as well as everyone's doing, 1881 01:14:40,480 --> 01:14:41,480 but anything in tech people, 1882 01:14:41,480 --> 01:14:42,480 where you're not, 1883 01:14:42,480 --> 01:14:42,480 no, 1884 01:14:42,480 --> 01:14:43,480 MasterDone, 1885 01:14:43,480 --> 01:14:43,480 MasterDone. 1886 01:14:43,480 --> 01:14:44,480 Well, 1887 01:14:44,480 --> 01:14:44,480 yeah, 1888 01:14:44,480 --> 01:14:45,480 and look at what's happening with 1889 01:14:45,480 --> 01:14:46,480 Matrix, 1890 01:14:46,480 --> 01:14:47,480 I don't know if you've read the blog post, 1891 01:14:47,480 --> 01:14:48,480 at the, 1892 01:14:48,480 --> 01:14:49,480 you know, 1893 01:14:49,480 --> 01:14:50,480 I find it, 1894 01:14:50,480 --> 01:14:51,480 and she'll die a trace 1895 01:14:51,480 --> 01:14:53,480 that they're in right now, 1896 01:14:53,480 --> 01:14:54,480 because, 1897 01:14:54,480 --> 01:14:55,480 you know, 1898 01:14:55,480 --> 01:14:56,480 they didn't, 1899 01:14:56,480 --> 01:14:58,480 well, 1900 01:14:58,480 --> 01:14:59,480 I don't know, 1901 01:14:59,480 --> 01:15:00,480 I'm not going to pass 1902 01:15:00,480 --> 01:15:01,480 judgment on it, 1903 01:15:01,480 --> 01:15:03,480 but they are a victim 1904 01:15:03,480 --> 01:15:05,480 of their own success, 1905 01:15:05,480 --> 01:15:06,480 let's say. 1906 01:15:06,480 --> 01:15:07,480 And also, 1907 01:15:07,480 --> 01:15:08,480 of the issue, 1908 01:15:08,480 --> 01:15:09,480 where people, 1909 01:15:09,480 --> 01:15:10,480 companies will use 1910 01:15:10,480 --> 01:15:12,480 staff and not pay for it, 1911 01:15:12,480 --> 01:15:13,480 not contribute to it 1912 01:15:13,480 --> 01:15:14,480 in any way, 1913 01:15:14,480 --> 01:15:15,480 because it's free in open source, 1914 01:15:15,480 --> 01:15:17,480 so therefore it's free as in there. 1915 01:15:17,480 --> 01:15:18,480 Yeah, 1916 01:15:18,480 --> 01:15:20,480 and I think that Matrix also suffered 1917 01:15:20,480 --> 01:15:21,480 from this problem of, 1918 01:15:21,480 --> 01:15:24,480 a lot of places use Matrix 1919 01:15:24,480 --> 01:15:26,480 and use specifically element, 1920 01:15:26,480 --> 01:15:27,480 as it is, 1921 01:15:27,480 --> 01:15:29,480 others such as the German government 1922 01:15:29,480 --> 01:15:31,480 have made their own clients 1923 01:15:31,480 --> 01:15:33,480 and things like that. 1924 01:15:33,480 --> 01:15:36,480 But what they haven't done, 1925 01:15:36,480 --> 01:15:38,480 then is made things that are useful 1926 01:15:38,480 --> 01:15:40,480 to the project as a whole, 1927 01:15:40,480 --> 01:15:40,480 so while, 1928 01:15:40,480 --> 01:15:41,480 of course, 1929 01:15:41,480 --> 01:15:42,480 they are upstreaming, 1930 01:15:42,480 --> 01:15:44,480 they're not upstreaming anything of use, 1931 01:15:44,480 --> 01:15:46,480 because it's all just very specific stuff 1932 01:15:46,480 --> 01:15:48,480 that only the German government would want. 1933 01:15:48,480 --> 01:15:50,480 And that's part of the problem as well, 1934 01:15:50,480 --> 01:15:51,480 because that creates, 1935 01:15:51,480 --> 01:15:53,480 it sounds helpful, 1936 01:15:53,480 --> 01:15:54,480 the German government's picking it up, 1937 01:15:54,480 --> 01:15:55,480 they're going to, 1938 01:15:55,480 --> 01:15:57,480 they're going to contribute code. 1939 01:15:57,480 --> 01:15:58,480 And of course, 1940 01:15:58,480 --> 01:15:59,480 they contribute, 1941 01:15:59,480 --> 01:16:01,480 but they contribute some useful stuff, 1942 01:16:01,480 --> 01:16:02,480 sometimes, 1943 01:16:02,480 --> 01:16:04,480 and that actually creates a lot more administrative overhead 1944 01:16:04,480 --> 01:16:05,480 for the upstream developers 1945 01:16:05,480 --> 01:16:07,480 to sift through all of that, 1946 01:16:07,480 --> 01:16:08,480 and make sure they're not including stuff 1947 01:16:08,480 --> 01:16:10,480 that wouldn't be useful elsewhere. 1948 01:16:10,480 --> 01:16:11,480 So it's a real, 1949 01:16:11,480 --> 01:16:12,480 I mean, 1950 01:16:12,480 --> 01:16:14,480 if the German government aren't paying 1951 01:16:14,480 --> 01:16:16,480 or Matrix, 1952 01:16:16,480 --> 01:16:18,480 that's a poor, 1953 01:16:18,480 --> 01:16:19,480 frankly, 1954 01:16:19,480 --> 01:16:20,480 it wouldn't surprise me. 1955 01:16:20,480 --> 01:16:21,480 I've heard of Matrix, 1956 01:16:21,480 --> 01:16:22,480 but I don't know if, 1957 01:16:22,480 --> 01:16:23,480 but what I'm going to say is, 1958 01:16:23,480 --> 01:16:24,480 or it could be like, 1959 01:16:24,480 --> 01:16:25,480 hey, 1960 01:16:25,480 --> 01:16:25,480 pick, 1961 01:16:25,480 --> 01:16:26,480 so you're using minutes, 1962 01:16:26,480 --> 01:16:27,480 make movies great, 1963 01:16:27,480 --> 01:16:28,480 although it turns out, 1964 01:16:28,480 --> 01:16:30,480 they've got doing commercial programming, 1965 01:16:30,480 --> 01:16:31,480 that's another point. 1966 01:16:31,480 --> 01:16:32,480 What I'm going to say, 1967 01:16:32,480 --> 01:16:33,480 well, 1968 01:16:33,480 --> 01:16:34,480 obviously, 1969 01:16:34,480 --> 01:16:35,480 with the software license, 1970 01:16:35,480 --> 01:16:37,480 if a company goes and goes, 1971 01:16:37,480 --> 01:16:38,480 hey, 1972 01:16:38,480 --> 01:16:38,480 look, 1973 01:16:38,480 --> 01:16:39,480 it's DPL code, 1974 01:16:39,480 --> 01:16:40,480 we'll just put that on TV, 1975 01:16:40,480 --> 01:16:41,480 software, 1976 01:16:41,480 --> 01:16:42,480 so I'm picking that sound, 1977 01:16:42,480 --> 01:16:43,480 that about, 1978 01:16:43,480 --> 01:16:43,480 then, 1979 01:16:43,480 --> 01:16:44,480 well, 1980 01:16:44,480 --> 01:16:45,480 says things like, 1981 01:16:45,480 --> 01:16:47,480 the software feed and controversy, 1982 01:16:47,480 --> 01:16:48,480 and the FFF, 1983 01:16:48,480 --> 01:16:49,480 obviously, 1984 01:16:49,480 --> 01:16:50,480 and FFFE, 1985 01:16:50,480 --> 01:16:51,480 as well, 1986 01:16:51,480 --> 01:16:52,480 and the UK does, 1987 01:16:52,480 --> 01:16:54,480 or is it open UK that, 1988 01:16:54,480 --> 01:16:55,480 one of those organizations, 1989 01:16:55,480 --> 01:16:56,480 you know, 1990 01:16:56,480 --> 01:16:57,480 they'll go to court over it, 1991 01:16:57,480 --> 01:16:58,480 potentially, 1992 01:16:58,480 --> 01:16:59,480 like, 1993 01:16:59,480 --> 01:17:00,480 you're both in the UK, 1994 01:17:00,480 --> 01:17:01,480 no, 1995 01:17:01,480 --> 01:17:02,480 you need to put in this your code, 1996 01:17:02,480 --> 01:17:03,480 you need to do stuff, 1997 01:17:03,480 --> 01:17:04,480 you know, 1998 01:17:04,480 --> 01:17:04,480 I mean, 1999 01:17:04,480 --> 01:17:05,480 I'm sure. 2000 01:17:05,480 --> 01:17:06,480 Yeah, 2001 01:17:06,480 --> 01:17:07,480 it's a real shame, 2002 01:17:07,480 --> 01:17:08,480 because, 2003 01:17:08,480 --> 01:17:09,480 on a sort of personal, 2004 01:17:09,480 --> 01:17:10,480 ethics level, 2005 01:17:10,480 --> 01:17:12,480 I really like the idea 2006 01:17:12,480 --> 01:17:14,480 of much more permissive licenses, 2007 01:17:14,480 --> 01:17:15,480 such as, 2008 01:17:15,480 --> 01:17:17,480 the MIT license, 2009 01:17:17,480 --> 01:17:19,480 and the two clause BSD license, 2010 01:17:19,480 --> 01:17:20,480 like those to me, 2011 01:17:20,480 --> 01:17:23,480 are much cleaner licenses than the GPS, 2012 01:17:23,480 --> 01:17:24,480 but unfortunately, 2013 01:17:24,480 --> 01:17:25,480 because of the, 2014 01:17:25,480 --> 01:17:26,480 the problem that, 2015 01:17:26,480 --> 01:17:27,480 Joe's highlighted, 2016 01:17:27,480 --> 01:17:29,480 if you use those licenses, 2017 01:17:29,480 --> 01:17:31,480 you run the risk of people taking your work, 2018 01:17:31,480 --> 01:17:33,480 and just not contributing back. 2019 01:17:33,480 --> 01:17:35,480 Sometimes you get lucky, 2020 01:17:35,480 --> 01:17:35,480 if, 2021 01:17:35,480 --> 01:17:36,480 in the example, 2022 01:17:36,480 --> 01:17:37,480 I would give there is, 2023 01:17:37,480 --> 01:17:40,480 Netflix heavily uses free BSD for their caching, 2024 01:17:40,480 --> 01:17:44,480 and they are massive contributors back to the free BSD, 2025 01:17:44,480 --> 01:17:45,480 which is wonderful. 2026 01:17:45,480 --> 01:17:46,480 And in their case, 2027 01:17:46,480 --> 01:17:47,480 it makes financial sense, 2028 01:17:47,480 --> 01:17:48,480 because, 2029 01:17:48,480 --> 01:17:48,480 you know, 2030 01:17:48,480 --> 01:17:49,480 they upstream it, 2031 01:17:49,480 --> 01:17:50,480 and it's up to the free BSD, 2032 01:17:50,480 --> 01:17:52,480 maintainers to maintain it from there, 2033 01:17:52,480 --> 01:17:53,480 but it's a positive, 2034 01:17:53,480 --> 01:17:54,480 net positive. 2035 01:17:54,480 --> 01:17:55,480 They do a lot of improvements. 2036 01:17:55,480 --> 01:17:57,480 But the vast majority of things, 2037 01:17:57,480 --> 01:17:58,480 if you, 2038 01:17:58,480 --> 01:18:01,480 if you do make them with a permissive license, 2039 01:18:01,480 --> 01:18:04,480 companies will take advantage of that. 2040 01:18:04,480 --> 01:18:07,480 And that's why viral licensing, 2041 01:18:07,480 --> 01:18:09,480 such as GPL exists, 2042 01:18:09,480 --> 01:18:09,480 you know, 2043 01:18:09,480 --> 01:18:12,480 and it's a real question you have to ask yourself, 2044 01:18:12,480 --> 01:18:13,480 when you're, 2045 01:18:13,480 --> 01:18:15,480 when you're starting a software project is, 2046 01:18:15,480 --> 01:18:16,480 do I, 2047 01:18:16,480 --> 01:18:20,480 do I want to make this under the license that I think is, 2048 01:18:20,480 --> 01:18:21,480 you know, 2049 01:18:21,480 --> 01:18:22,480 my personal favor, 2050 01:18:22,480 --> 01:18:24,480 which in my cases MIT, 2051 01:18:24,480 --> 01:18:26,480 or do I need to protect myself from, 2052 01:18:26,480 --> 01:18:27,480 you know, 2053 01:18:27,480 --> 01:18:28,480 future fevery. 2054 01:18:28,480 --> 01:18:29,480 And, 2055 01:18:29,480 --> 01:18:30,480 you know, 2056 01:18:30,480 --> 01:18:32,480 these kinds of decisions are difficult, 2057 01:18:32,480 --> 01:18:34,480 and they have long lasting ramifications, 2058 01:18:34,480 --> 01:18:36,480 for how your software goes. 2059 01:18:36,480 --> 01:18:36,480 So, 2060 01:18:36,480 --> 01:18:38,480 there's no easy answer to any of this. 2061 01:18:38,480 --> 01:18:39,480 I actually had a question though, 2062 01:18:39,480 --> 01:18:40,480 for Joe. 2063 01:18:40,480 --> 01:18:42,480 When you said, you know, 2064 01:18:42,480 --> 01:18:43,480 you sell ads. 2065 01:18:43,480 --> 01:18:44,480 I've not actually, 2066 01:18:44,480 --> 01:18:45,480 I don't listen to many podcasts, 2067 01:18:45,480 --> 01:18:46,480 I've not come across it, 2068 01:18:46,480 --> 01:18:49,480 but is the format of that that you read ads, 2069 01:18:49,480 --> 01:18:51,480 as part of the show? 2070 01:18:51,480 --> 01:18:52,480 Yes. 2071 01:18:52,480 --> 01:18:56,480 So it's baked in host red mid rolls, 2072 01:18:56,480 --> 01:18:58,480 in your jargon. 2073 01:18:58,480 --> 01:18:59,480 Yeah. 2074 01:18:59,480 --> 01:19:01,480 So like I sell, 2075 01:19:01,480 --> 01:19:03,480 ideally a bunch of ads, 2076 01:19:03,480 --> 01:19:05,480 but sometimes just single ones to companies. 2077 01:19:05,480 --> 01:19:06,480 And then, 2078 01:19:06,480 --> 01:19:07,480 yeah, 2079 01:19:07,480 --> 01:19:08,480 we agree a 60 second script, 2080 01:19:08,480 --> 01:19:10,480 and then I do my advert, 2081 01:19:10,480 --> 01:19:11,480 okay, 2082 01:19:11,480 --> 01:19:12,480 this episode is sponsored. 2083 01:19:12,480 --> 01:19:12,480 I, 2084 01:19:12,480 --> 01:19:13,480 this company, 2085 01:19:13,480 --> 01:19:14,480 go to this company, 2086 01:19:14,480 --> 01:19:16,480 is URL.com slash global bar. 2087 01:19:16,480 --> 01:19:17,480 They're great. 2088 01:19:17,480 --> 01:19:18,480 And you should check them out. 2089 01:19:18,480 --> 01:19:19,480 And progress. 2090 01:19:19,480 --> 01:19:20,480 So that's, 2091 01:19:20,480 --> 01:19:22,480 this company.com slash LNL, 2092 01:19:22,480 --> 01:19:23,480 or whatever. 2093 01:19:23,480 --> 01:19:24,480 So yeah. 2094 01:19:24,480 --> 01:19:25,480 That's, 2095 01:19:25,480 --> 01:19:26,480 that's how I do, 2096 01:19:26,480 --> 01:19:26,480 yeah, 2097 01:19:26,480 --> 01:19:28,480 I do direct sales. 2098 01:19:28,480 --> 01:19:29,480 I have, 2099 01:19:29,480 --> 01:19:31,480 I have things in the works with agencies, 2100 01:19:31,480 --> 01:19:35,480 but I found that to be an immensely frustrating experience, 2101 01:19:35,480 --> 01:19:36,480 here the two. 2102 01:19:36,480 --> 01:19:37,480 But we'll see, 2103 01:19:37,480 --> 01:19:39,480 that's kind of why I want to talk to you about this properly, 2104 01:19:39,480 --> 01:19:41,480 like privately and when I'm sorry. 2105 01:19:41,480 --> 01:19:42,480 Yeah, 2106 01:19:42,480 --> 01:19:42,480 I mean, 2107 01:19:42,480 --> 01:19:43,480 I don't know how much I'll be, 2108 01:19:43,480 --> 01:19:45,480 but I'm happy to see what I know. 2109 01:19:45,480 --> 01:19:47,480 But I was just going to ask then, 2110 01:19:47,480 --> 01:19:48,480 for, 2111 01:19:48,480 --> 01:19:50,480 and I'm guessing the way that this is worked out, 2112 01:19:50,480 --> 01:19:51,480 and the way that it's, 2113 01:19:51,480 --> 01:19:52,480 you know, 2114 01:19:52,480 --> 01:19:54,480 the sort of pain that comes out of this is worked out. 2115 01:19:54,480 --> 01:19:57,480 It's based on the number of people who head to the, 2116 01:19:57,480 --> 01:19:59,480 the link you specified, 2117 01:19:59,480 --> 01:20:00,480 and, 2118 01:20:00,480 --> 01:20:01,480 you know, 2119 01:20:01,480 --> 01:20:03,480 that's how the payouts happen. 2120 01:20:03,480 --> 01:20:04,480 Well, 2121 01:20:04,480 --> 01:20:09,480 I don't want to go too far into my corporate secrets, 2122 01:20:09,480 --> 01:20:10,480 as it were, 2123 01:20:10,480 --> 01:20:12,480 but now it's based on the, 2124 01:20:12,480 --> 01:20:15,480 the number of people who regularly download, 2125 01:20:15,480 --> 01:20:17,480 and what you get there is a CPM, 2126 01:20:17,480 --> 01:20:18,480 cost per million, 2127 01:20:18,480 --> 01:20:19,480 cost per thousand. 2128 01:20:19,480 --> 01:20:20,480 And so, 2129 01:20:20,480 --> 01:20:21,480 seeing have, 2130 01:20:21,480 --> 01:20:23,480 I don't know, 2131 01:20:23,480 --> 01:20:24,480 what's the simple thing, 2132 01:20:24,480 --> 01:20:25,480 10,000 people listening, 2133 01:20:25,480 --> 01:20:27,480 so that your mod's player is 10, 2134 01:20:27,480 --> 01:20:28,480 so I say you, 2135 01:20:28,480 --> 01:20:29,480 you're going to charge them, 2136 01:20:29,480 --> 01:20:32,480 a million dollars per thousand people who listen. 2137 01:20:32,480 --> 01:20:35,480 It is orders of magnitude less than that, obviously. 2138 01:20:35,480 --> 01:20:39,480 But let's say it's $5 per thousand people who listen, 2139 01:20:39,480 --> 01:20:41,480 and you have 10,000 people listening, 2140 01:20:41,480 --> 01:20:42,480 on average, 2141 01:20:42,480 --> 01:20:44,480 so therefore you charge them five times ten, 2142 01:20:44,480 --> 01:20:46,480 is $50 per average. 2143 01:20:46,480 --> 01:20:50,480 Obviously those figures are not the real ones, 2144 01:20:50,480 --> 01:20:51,480 but, 2145 01:20:51,480 --> 01:20:54,480 so that's the sort of traditional baked-in way, 2146 01:20:54,480 --> 01:20:57,480 my understanding of, 2147 01:20:57,480 --> 01:21:00,480 dynamically inserted ads is that, 2148 01:21:00,480 --> 01:21:03,480 it's more a case of you agree a CPM, 2149 01:21:03,480 --> 01:21:06,480 and so say it's $5 per thousand people, 2150 01:21:06,480 --> 01:21:07,480 and they say right, 2151 01:21:07,480 --> 01:21:09,480 well our budget is, 2152 01:21:13,480 --> 01:21:15,480 about $5,000, 2153 01:21:15,480 --> 01:21:20,480 so therefore we will pay for thousand impressions, 2154 01:21:20,480 --> 01:21:22,480 so it's more like the old school, 2155 01:21:22,480 --> 01:21:24,480 you know, 2156 01:21:24,480 --> 01:21:26,480 banner ads and text ads, 2157 01:21:26,480 --> 01:21:27,480 so it's, 2158 01:21:27,480 --> 01:21:29,480 they will dynamically insert into the first, 2159 01:21:29,480 --> 01:21:32,480 thousand downloads there ad, 2160 01:21:32,480 --> 01:21:35,480 and that can either be programmatic as they call it, 2161 01:21:35,480 --> 01:21:40,480 which is read by just some voice actor person 2162 01:21:40,480 --> 01:21:42,480 in a studio somewhere, 2163 01:21:42,480 --> 01:21:44,480 or it can be hostred, 2164 01:21:44,480 --> 01:21:47,480 and you get more money for the hostred ones. 2165 01:21:47,480 --> 01:21:50,480 And so you just say in their platform, 2166 01:21:50,480 --> 01:21:51,480 you know, 2167 01:21:51,480 --> 01:21:52,480 you upload your M3, 2168 01:21:52,480 --> 01:21:53,480 and you say right, 2169 01:21:53,480 --> 01:21:54,480 10 minutes and 45 seconds, 2170 01:21:54,480 --> 01:21:55,480 here's the ad break, 2171 01:21:55,480 --> 01:21:57,480 and so day then, 2172 01:21:57,480 --> 01:22:02,480 dynamically insert a thousand of those that people have paid, 2173 01:22:02,480 --> 01:22:03,480 you know, 2174 01:22:03,480 --> 01:22:06,480 the first thousand people that download that episode, 2175 01:22:06,480 --> 01:22:09,480 they dynamically insert the advert 2176 01:22:09,480 --> 01:22:11,480 for this mattress company, 2177 01:22:11,480 --> 01:22:12,480 whatever, 2178 01:22:12,480 --> 01:22:13,480 and then once a thousand done, 2179 01:22:13,480 --> 01:22:14,480 that's it, 2180 01:22:14,480 --> 01:22:15,480 and you get paid. 2181 01:22:15,480 --> 01:22:18,480 So it's sort of quite a different way of doing it, 2182 01:22:18,480 --> 01:22:20,480 to how I have traditionally done it, 2183 01:22:20,480 --> 01:22:21,480 which is, 2184 01:22:21,480 --> 01:22:23,480 we have X number of people downloading, 2185 01:22:23,480 --> 01:22:24,480 you know, 2186 01:22:24,480 --> 01:22:25,480 X number of thousands of people, 2187 01:22:25,480 --> 01:22:27,480 and so that multiplier, 2188 01:22:27,480 --> 01:22:29,480 we will multiply by the CPM number, 2189 01:22:29,480 --> 01:22:30,480 which we will agree, 2190 01:22:30,480 --> 01:22:34,480 which obviously depends on the company dealing with, 2191 01:22:34,480 --> 01:22:35,480 and you know, 2192 01:22:35,480 --> 01:22:36,480 negotiation skills, et cetera, 2193 01:22:36,480 --> 01:22:37,480 and you know, 2194 01:22:37,480 --> 01:22:39,480 I've heard of CPM's as low as $5, 2195 01:22:39,480 --> 01:22:41,480 or as much as $150, 2196 01:22:41,480 --> 01:22:44,480 and somewhere in between, 2197 01:22:44,480 --> 01:22:45,480 like, 2198 01:22:45,480 --> 01:22:47,480 as most of the deals that I have done, 2199 01:22:47,480 --> 01:22:48,480 let's just say. 2200 01:22:48,480 --> 01:22:50,480 Okay, now that's interesting, 2201 01:22:50,480 --> 01:22:52,480 I ask mostly because, 2202 01:22:52,480 --> 01:22:54,480 the project I work on, 2203 01:22:54,480 --> 01:22:57,480 we have rudimentary podcasting tools, 2204 01:22:57,480 --> 01:22:58,480 and, you know, 2205 01:22:58,480 --> 01:23:00,480 as I mentioned cast apart there, 2206 01:23:00,480 --> 01:23:01,480 a direct, 2207 01:23:01,480 --> 01:23:02,480 I wouldn't say there are competitors 2208 01:23:02,480 --> 01:23:03,480 to us, 2209 01:23:03,480 --> 01:23:04,480 we're not competing really, 2210 01:23:04,480 --> 01:23:07,480 but they have done a lot of work around, 2211 01:23:07,480 --> 01:23:09,480 monetization, 2212 01:23:09,480 --> 01:23:11,480 and we have rather more, 2213 01:23:11,480 --> 01:23:15,480 hesitant to get into the monetization side of things, 2214 01:23:15,480 --> 01:23:17,480 specifically around advertising. 2215 01:23:17,480 --> 01:23:19,480 We really don't want to have, 2216 01:23:19,480 --> 01:23:20,480 like you say, 2217 01:23:20,480 --> 01:23:21,480 dynamic advertising, 2218 01:23:21,480 --> 01:23:23,480 be something that we offer, 2219 01:23:23,480 --> 01:23:26,480 something like host red advertising. 2220 01:23:26,480 --> 01:23:27,480 I'm trying to just, 2221 01:23:27,480 --> 01:23:30,480 I didn't really understand how it worked before this, 2222 01:23:30,480 --> 01:23:33,480 but it would explain why people find things 2223 01:23:33,480 --> 01:23:35,480 such as the viewership numbers, 2224 01:23:35,480 --> 01:23:37,480 or the listenership numbers so important, 2225 01:23:37,480 --> 01:23:40,480 and it's just something for me to bear in mind, 2226 01:23:40,480 --> 01:23:44,480 when we come to revisit podcasting as a feature set, 2227 01:23:44,480 --> 01:23:46,480 that having better analytics 2228 01:23:46,480 --> 01:23:49,480 is a super important way of getting people, 2229 01:23:49,480 --> 01:23:51,480 you know, 2230 01:23:51,480 --> 01:23:54,480 giving people more avenues for payment than just, 2231 01:23:54,480 --> 01:23:55,480 you know, 2232 01:23:55,480 --> 01:23:56,480 what the, 2233 01:23:56,480 --> 01:23:57,480 the we prefer, 2234 01:23:57,480 --> 01:23:58,480 which is, 2235 01:23:58,480 --> 01:23:59,480 you know, 2236 01:23:59,480 --> 01:24:03,480 direct endorsement or direct donation, 2237 01:24:03,480 --> 01:24:04,480 because, 2238 01:24:04,480 --> 01:24:06,480 so let me just, 2239 01:24:06,480 --> 01:24:07,480 let me just say this, 2240 01:24:07,480 --> 01:24:08,480 let me just say this right, 2241 01:24:08,480 --> 01:24:10,480 that unless you have, 2242 01:24:10,480 --> 01:24:12,480 like a million, 2243 01:24:12,480 --> 01:24:14,480 plus downloads a year, 2244 01:24:14,480 --> 01:24:16,480 well, 2245 01:24:16,480 --> 01:24:17,480 I don't know, 2246 01:24:17,480 --> 01:24:18,480 let's just say, 2247 01:24:18,480 --> 01:24:20,480 hundreds of thousands, 2248 01:24:20,480 --> 01:24:22,480 hundreds of downloads per year, 2249 01:24:22,480 --> 01:24:24,480 advertisers not interested these days, 2250 01:24:24,480 --> 01:24:25,480 generally speaking, 2251 01:24:25,480 --> 01:24:28,480 is my understanding of the market right now. 2252 01:24:28,480 --> 01:24:29,480 Yeah, 2253 01:24:29,480 --> 01:24:31,480 and let me also say this right, 2254 01:24:31,480 --> 01:24:35,480 that even in a situation where you've got, 2255 01:24:35,480 --> 01:24:40,480 an audience that fully understands that, 2256 01:24:40,480 --> 01:24:43,480 you know, 2257 01:24:43,480 --> 01:24:44,480 the donation model, 2258 01:24:44,480 --> 01:24:47,480 or pay what you can as elementary do, 2259 01:24:47,480 --> 01:24:48,480 you know, 2260 01:24:48,480 --> 01:24:49,480 the phrase that is, 2261 01:24:49,480 --> 01:24:51,480 pay what you can rather than pay, 2262 01:24:51,480 --> 01:24:52,480 what you want, 2263 01:24:52,480 --> 01:24:53,480 but anyway, 2264 01:24:53,480 --> 01:24:55,480 basically the donation model, 2265 01:24:55,480 --> 01:24:57,480 you are never going to crack more than a few, 2266 01:24:57,480 --> 01:24:59,480 percent of people who are willing to pay for it, 2267 01:24:59,480 --> 01:25:00,480 on the answer that, 2268 01:25:00,480 --> 01:25:01,480 but is, 2269 01:25:01,480 --> 01:25:02,480 is my understanding, 2270 01:25:02,480 --> 01:25:03,480 and look, 2271 01:25:03,480 --> 01:25:04,480 if you, 2272 01:25:04,480 --> 01:25:05,480 it, 2273 01:25:05,480 --> 01:25:07,480 find me someone who is cracked more than a few, 2274 01:25:07,480 --> 01:25:08,480 percent, 2275 01:25:08,480 --> 01:25:10,480 and I want to go for beers with them, 2276 01:25:10,480 --> 01:25:13,480 and pick their brains on how the fuck they did that. 2277 01:25:13,480 --> 01:25:14,480 Yeah, 2278 01:25:14,480 --> 01:25:15,480 and I, 2279 01:25:15,480 --> 01:25:16,480 I totally agree, 2280 01:25:16,480 --> 01:25:17,480 that, 2281 01:25:17,480 --> 01:25:18,480 you know, 2282 01:25:18,480 --> 01:25:18,480 we've, 2283 01:25:18,480 --> 01:25:19,480 like I say, 2284 01:25:19,480 --> 01:25:20,480 we've struggled with it, 2285 01:25:20,480 --> 01:25:21,480 we've been looking into it, 2286 01:25:21,480 --> 01:25:24,480 and we are of mostly donation funded projects, 2287 01:25:24,480 --> 01:25:26,480 but there's a big difference between a project, 2288 01:25:26,480 --> 01:25:26,480 and a, 2289 01:25:26,480 --> 01:25:27,480 you know, 2290 01:25:27,480 --> 01:25:28,480 an individually created, 2291 01:25:28,480 --> 01:25:29,480 you know, 2292 01:25:29,480 --> 01:25:30,480 podcast, 2293 01:25:30,480 --> 01:25:31,480 I think, 2294 01:25:31,480 --> 01:25:33,480 but that's why we, 2295 01:25:33,480 --> 01:25:35,480 we like this idea of having, 2296 01:25:35,480 --> 01:25:36,480 let's say that, 2297 01:25:36,480 --> 01:25:39,480 if you give a value proposition to users, 2298 01:25:39,480 --> 01:25:40,480 for using this, 2299 01:25:40,480 --> 01:25:41,480 this part, 2300 01:25:41,480 --> 01:25:42,480 for my talk about retrobeats, 2301 01:25:42,480 --> 01:25:43,480 and you say, 2302 01:25:43,480 --> 01:25:43,480 okay, 2303 01:25:43,480 --> 01:25:45,480 let's say you gave five euros a month, 2304 01:25:45,480 --> 01:25:46,480 a month, 2305 01:25:46,480 --> 01:25:47,480 to, 2306 01:25:47,480 --> 01:25:48,480 you know, 2307 01:25:48,480 --> 01:25:49,480 and you just had that allocated, 2308 01:25:49,480 --> 01:25:50,480 and it spread, 2309 01:25:50,480 --> 01:25:53,480 between your most listened podcast, 2310 01:25:53,480 --> 01:25:54,480 randomly, 2311 01:25:54,480 --> 01:25:56,480 whichever ones you most listen to, 2312 01:25:56,480 --> 01:25:58,480 or whatever ones you most interact with, 2313 01:25:58,480 --> 01:25:59,480 or whatever it may be, 2314 01:25:59,480 --> 01:26:00,480 or random, 2315 01:26:00,480 --> 01:26:01,480 who knows, 2316 01:26:01,480 --> 01:26:02,480 I, 2317 01:26:02,480 --> 01:26:02,480 I, 2318 01:26:02,480 --> 01:26:03,480 I wonder if that's, 2319 01:26:03,480 --> 01:26:03,480 and, 2320 01:26:03,480 --> 01:26:04,480 and you know, 2321 01:26:04,480 --> 01:26:05,480 spread that across multiple users, 2322 01:26:05,480 --> 01:26:06,480 who might be willing to do it. 2323 01:26:06,480 --> 01:26:07,480 I wonder if that, 2324 01:26:07,480 --> 01:26:09,480 would start to sort of yield results, 2325 01:26:09,480 --> 01:26:10,480 because at the moment, 2326 01:26:10,480 --> 01:26:12,480 we're seeing the problem that I mentioned about whales, 2327 01:26:12,480 --> 01:26:14,480 where you have a lot, 2328 01:26:14,480 --> 01:26:16,480 and most people will not pay anything, 2329 01:26:16,480 --> 01:26:19,480 and a few will pay thousands, 2330 01:26:19,480 --> 01:26:20,480 you know, 2331 01:26:20,480 --> 01:26:21,480 and, 2332 01:26:21,480 --> 01:26:22,480 well, 2333 01:26:22,480 --> 01:26:23,480 let me stop doing it, 2334 01:26:23,480 --> 01:26:25,480 because what you're talking about exists, 2335 01:26:25,480 --> 01:26:26,480 right, 2336 01:26:26,480 --> 01:26:27,480 what you're talking about exists, 2337 01:26:27,480 --> 01:26:29,480 and it is called podcasting 2.0, 2338 01:26:29,480 --> 01:26:31,480 and there are a whole bunch of new podcasting, 2339 01:26:31,480 --> 01:26:33,480 new podcasting now, 2340 01:26:33,480 --> 01:26:34,480 and, 2341 01:26:34,480 --> 01:26:35,480 yeah, 2342 01:26:35,480 --> 01:26:37,480 those people do that, 2343 01:26:37,480 --> 01:26:39,480 and certain other things. 2344 01:26:39,480 --> 01:26:41,480 It works, 2345 01:26:41,480 --> 01:26:42,480 so you're correct. 2346 01:26:42,480 --> 01:26:43,480 I'm glad you found a piece of it that works for you, 2347 01:26:43,480 --> 01:26:44,480 too, 2348 01:26:44,480 --> 01:26:45,480 that's best, 2349 01:26:45,480 --> 01:26:46,480 effing awesome, 2350 01:26:46,480 --> 01:26:47,480 self-sensoring, 2351 01:26:47,480 --> 01:26:48,480 you're sorry. 2352 01:26:48,480 --> 01:26:49,480 Are we allowed to say fuck here? 2353 01:26:49,480 --> 01:26:50,480 Well, 2354 01:26:50,480 --> 01:26:50,480 we are, 2355 01:26:50,480 --> 01:26:52,480 but then Apple says you can't put, 2356 01:26:52,480 --> 01:26:52,480 like, 2357 01:26:52,480 --> 01:26:53,480 a kid smiley face on it, 2358 01:26:53,480 --> 01:26:55,480 which I never thought should have been on it in the first place. 2359 01:26:55,480 --> 01:26:57,480 So fuck Apple did it. 2360 01:26:57,480 --> 01:26:58,480 Just, 2361 01:26:58,480 --> 01:27:00,480 on the other hand, 2362 01:27:00,480 --> 01:27:01,480 you know, 2363 01:27:01,480 --> 01:27:02,480 you might, 2364 01:27:02,480 --> 01:27:04,480 something I say might be so, 2365 01:27:04,480 --> 01:27:05,480 effing brilliant, 2366 01:27:05,480 --> 01:27:06,480 you want to play it for your kids, 2367 01:27:06,480 --> 01:27:08,480 so I watch out for that on my part. 2368 01:27:08,480 --> 01:27:09,480 Fair enough. 2369 01:27:09,480 --> 01:27:10,480 But anyway, 2370 01:27:10,480 --> 01:27:11,480 the, 2371 01:27:11,480 --> 01:27:14,480 the dream of podcasting 2.0 is genius. 2372 01:27:14,480 --> 01:27:16,480 It's exactly what you were just talking about. 2373 01:27:16,480 --> 01:27:17,480 It's, 2374 01:27:17,480 --> 01:27:18,480 it's the idea that, 2375 01:27:18,480 --> 01:27:20,480 everybody contributes a tiny bit, 2376 01:27:20,480 --> 01:27:21,480 you know, 2377 01:27:21,480 --> 01:27:22,480 they decide right. 2378 01:27:22,480 --> 01:27:23,480 My budget for the month, 2379 01:27:23,480 --> 01:27:24,480 or for the year, 2380 01:27:24,480 --> 01:27:25,480 is $5.10, 2381 01:27:25,480 --> 01:27:27,480 or whatever. 2382 01:27:27,480 --> 01:27:28,480 Hold on, 2383 01:27:28,480 --> 01:27:32,480 that's a very small part of podcasting 2.0. 2384 01:27:32,480 --> 01:27:35,480 The financial part of it is what everyone focuses on. 2385 01:27:35,480 --> 01:27:36,480 So it looks huge, 2386 01:27:36,480 --> 01:27:38,480 because it's under a lot of magnifying glasses. 2387 01:27:38,480 --> 01:27:40,480 It's just a wedge of the pie, though. 2388 01:27:40,480 --> 01:27:42,480 That's literally what we've been 2389 01:27:42,480 --> 01:27:43,480 in about for the last time. 2390 01:27:43,480 --> 01:27:44,480 It's, 2391 01:27:44,480 --> 01:27:46,480 it's monetizing things generally. 2392 01:27:46,480 --> 01:27:46,480 So, 2393 01:27:46,480 --> 01:27:47,480 yes, 2394 01:27:47,480 --> 01:27:47,480 of course. 2395 01:27:47,480 --> 01:27:48,480 Yes, 2396 01:27:48,480 --> 01:27:49,480 but you said podcasting 2.0. 2397 01:27:49,480 --> 01:27:53,480 So I would hate for anyone who hasn't heard of podcasting 2.0 2398 01:27:53,480 --> 01:27:55,480 to think that, 2399 01:27:55,480 --> 01:27:57,480 everything we've talked about for the last hour, 2400 01:27:57,480 --> 01:27:58,480 encapsulate podcasting 2.0. 2401 01:27:58,480 --> 01:27:59,480 Podcasting 2.0. 2402 01:27:59,480 --> 01:28:00,480 All right. 2403 01:28:00,480 --> 01:28:00,480 Well, 2404 01:28:00,480 --> 01:28:01,480 let me cut to the chase then. 2405 01:28:01,480 --> 01:28:02,480 All right. 2406 01:28:02,480 --> 01:28:03,480 Let me cut to the chase then. 2407 01:28:03,480 --> 01:28:04,480 And the, 2408 01:28:04,480 --> 01:28:06,480 the kind of the chase is two podcasting 2409 01:28:06,480 --> 01:28:11,480 that podcasting 2.0 is tainted by crypto bullshit. 2410 01:28:11,480 --> 01:28:13,480 And so, 2411 01:28:13,480 --> 01:28:14,480 therefore, 2412 01:28:14,480 --> 01:28:16,480 I want nothing to do with it, 2413 01:28:16,480 --> 01:28:18,480 because crypto is positive, 2414 01:28:18,480 --> 01:28:20,480 bullshit. 2415 01:28:20,480 --> 01:28:21,480 Correct. 2416 01:28:21,480 --> 01:28:22,480 I mean, 2417 01:28:22,480 --> 01:28:23,480 if you want to agree, 2418 01:28:23,480 --> 01:28:25,480 if you want to disagree with me, 2419 01:28:25,480 --> 01:28:26,480 I mean, 2420 01:28:26,480 --> 01:28:27,480 we can. 2421 01:28:27,480 --> 01:28:27,480 Yes, 2422 01:28:27,480 --> 01:28:28,480 disagree on this. 2423 01:28:28,480 --> 01:28:30,480 Can I have 10 seconds to disagree? 2424 01:28:30,480 --> 01:28:31,480 I mean, 2425 01:28:31,480 --> 01:28:32,480 you can, 2426 01:28:32,480 --> 01:28:33,480 but I'll probably take my headphones off. 2427 01:28:33,480 --> 01:28:34,480 No, 2428 01:28:34,480 --> 01:28:35,480 no, 2429 01:28:35,480 --> 01:28:36,480 I have, 2430 01:28:36,480 --> 01:28:39,480 I would like to rebut a piece of what you just said, 2431 01:28:39,480 --> 01:28:41,480 not the entire thing in a reasonable way. 2432 01:28:41,480 --> 01:28:43,480 And if you think I'm being unreasonable, 2433 01:28:43,480 --> 01:28:45,480 I would appreciate that feedback as well. 2434 01:28:45,480 --> 01:28:46,480 Right. 2435 01:28:46,480 --> 01:28:46,480 Well, 2436 01:28:46,480 --> 01:28:47,480 let me just say this. 2437 01:28:47,480 --> 01:28:50,480 Crypto bullshit or not bullshit. 2438 01:28:50,480 --> 01:28:51,480 Are you saying that? 2439 01:28:51,480 --> 01:28:52,480 Are you asking that? 2440 01:28:52,480 --> 01:28:53,480 That's the question. 2441 01:28:53,480 --> 01:28:56,480 It's like a Y slash and crypto is bullshit. 2442 01:28:56,480 --> 01:28:57,480 Y slash and underscore. 2443 01:28:57,480 --> 01:28:59,480 That wasn't my question. 2444 01:28:59,480 --> 01:29:01,480 Do I have to answer your question before you let it remind? 2445 01:29:01,480 --> 01:29:02,480 No. 2446 01:29:02,480 --> 01:29:03,480 Feel free to answer it. 2447 01:29:03,480 --> 01:29:05,480 To ask me any question you'd like so. 2448 01:29:05,480 --> 01:29:06,480 Okay. 2449 01:29:06,480 --> 01:29:07,480 And I will answer yours next. 2450 01:29:07,480 --> 01:29:09,480 If you still are interested in what I care, 2451 01:29:09,480 --> 01:29:13,480 you can cut that part out of podcasting 2.0. 2452 01:29:13,480 --> 01:29:15,480 You don't have to use that at all. 2453 01:29:15,480 --> 01:29:16,480 Right. 2454 01:29:16,480 --> 01:29:18,480 That wasn't that was a statement. 2455 01:29:18,480 --> 01:29:21,480 Are you aware that you can cut that out of podcasting 2.0. 2456 01:29:21,480 --> 01:29:25,480 It is still a marvelous landscape without that included. 2457 01:29:25,480 --> 01:29:26,480 That was my question. 2458 01:29:26,480 --> 01:29:27,480 Right. 2459 01:29:27,480 --> 01:29:28,480 So, 2460 01:29:28,480 --> 01:29:29,480 right. 2461 01:29:29,480 --> 01:29:30,480 So my answer to that question is, 2462 01:29:30,480 --> 01:29:35,480 of course, I'm aware that the monetization aspect of podcasting 2.0 is. 2463 01:29:35,480 --> 01:29:36,480 So it's very good. 2464 01:29:36,480 --> 01:29:38,480 It's much one of the aspects of it. 2465 01:29:38,480 --> 01:29:41,480 And chat is new tags. 2466 01:29:41,480 --> 01:29:43,480 And it loads of other cool stuff. 2467 01:29:43,480 --> 01:29:44,480 Right. 2468 01:29:44,480 --> 01:29:46,480 I totally, I'm going to totally aware of that. 2469 01:29:46,480 --> 01:29:47,480 So you think you're asking? 2470 01:29:47,480 --> 01:29:47,480 No. 2471 01:29:47,480 --> 01:29:48,480 Let me. 2472 01:29:48,480 --> 01:29:49,480 Go ahead. 2473 01:29:49,480 --> 01:29:50,480 I'll get from you. 2474 01:29:50,480 --> 01:29:50,480 No. 2475 01:29:50,480 --> 01:29:51,480 You can't. 2476 01:29:51,480 --> 01:29:51,480 You know, 2477 01:29:51,480 --> 01:29:52,480 you don't put words in my mouth, right? 2478 01:29:52,480 --> 01:29:53,480 It's not cool. 2479 01:29:53,480 --> 01:29:54,480 Just because. 2480 01:29:54,480 --> 01:29:55,480 The rest of it was cool. 2481 01:29:55,480 --> 01:29:56,480 No. 2482 01:29:56,480 --> 01:29:58,480 I said that there are aspects of it, 2483 01:29:58,480 --> 01:29:59,480 which are. 2484 01:29:59,480 --> 01:30:00,480 Okay. 2485 01:30:00,480 --> 01:30:01,480 Not the rest of it. 2486 01:30:01,480 --> 01:30:01,480 Okay. 2487 01:30:01,480 --> 01:30:02,480 I'm sorry. 2488 01:30:02,480 --> 01:30:03,480 Correct. 2489 01:30:03,480 --> 01:30:03,480 Right. 2490 01:30:03,480 --> 01:30:04,480 I should not. 2491 01:30:04,480 --> 01:30:05,480 However. 2492 01:30:05,480 --> 01:30:06,480 Thank you. 2493 01:30:06,480 --> 01:30:07,480 Right. 2494 01:30:07,480 --> 01:30:08,480 Just imagine this, right? 2495 01:30:08,480 --> 01:30:11,480 Just imagine the most delicious food that you can imagine. 2496 01:30:11,480 --> 01:30:13,480 Maybe that's a chocolate cake. 2497 01:30:13,480 --> 01:30:16,480 Maybe that's a delicious English breakfast fry up. 2498 01:30:16,480 --> 01:30:17,480 Maybe it's the most delicious. 2499 01:30:17,480 --> 01:30:19,480 I haven't heard this before. 2500 01:30:19,480 --> 01:30:20,480 Right. 2501 01:30:20,480 --> 01:30:22,480 But just imagine you've cooked. 2502 01:30:22,480 --> 01:30:23,480 Just whoever's listening right now. 2503 01:30:23,480 --> 01:30:26,480 Just imagine you've cooked the perfect meal. 2504 01:30:26,480 --> 01:30:28,480 Or someone else has cooked it for you. 2505 01:30:28,480 --> 01:30:30,480 Friends of yours, maybe you've paid whatever. 2506 01:30:30,480 --> 01:30:34,480 You are sitting down to the most delicious meal in the world. 2507 01:30:34,480 --> 01:30:35,480 Right? 2508 01:30:35,480 --> 01:30:37,480 It's better than anything else you've eaten. 2509 01:30:37,480 --> 01:30:38,480 Right? 2510 01:30:38,480 --> 01:30:40,480 However, on the same table, 2511 01:30:40,480 --> 01:30:43,480 there is a big plate of steaming shit. 2512 01:30:43,480 --> 01:30:45,480 And that is crypto. 2513 01:30:45,480 --> 01:30:48,480 And that has tainted the entire meal. 2514 01:30:48,480 --> 01:30:51,480 And crypto has tainted the entire podcast in 2.0. 2515 01:30:51,480 --> 01:30:54,480 And so that's it. 2516 01:30:54,480 --> 01:30:55,480 You can't just. 2517 01:30:55,480 --> 01:30:58,480 Even if you even if you take that plate of steaming shit. 2518 01:30:58,480 --> 01:30:59,480 Oh, the room. 2519 01:30:59,480 --> 01:31:02,480 It's still stinks. 2520 01:31:02,480 --> 01:31:05,480 And you're not hungry anymore for the show. 2521 01:31:05,480 --> 01:31:06,480 One delicious food. 2522 01:31:06,480 --> 01:31:08,480 Joe may I out of love. 2523 01:31:08,480 --> 01:31:09,480 I'm saying this to you. 2524 01:31:09,480 --> 01:31:12,480 If the table's big enough and full enough, 2525 01:31:12,480 --> 01:31:16,480 it doesn't matter what somebody far enough away is doing. 2526 01:31:16,480 --> 01:31:18,480 It's, you know what I mean? 2527 01:31:18,480 --> 01:31:19,480 It hurts to shut people out. 2528 01:31:19,480 --> 01:31:24,480 I have no pain in shutting crypto grows out because that shit is 2529 01:31:24,480 --> 01:31:27,480 fucking bullshit, scam, 2530 01:31:27,480 --> 01:31:31,480 pyramid scheme, Ponzi scheme shit that has no room 2531 01:31:31,480 --> 01:31:34,480 in anything that I'm willing to touch. 2532 01:31:34,480 --> 01:31:36,480 It's fucking bullshit. 2533 01:31:36,480 --> 01:31:37,480 And we get fucked. 2534 01:31:37,480 --> 01:31:38,480 Yes, I agree. 2535 01:31:38,480 --> 01:31:39,480 I said it. 2536 01:31:39,480 --> 01:31:41,480 Would you like to hear my answer since you asked me? 2537 01:31:41,480 --> 01:31:42,480 I agreed. 2538 01:31:42,480 --> 01:31:43,480 I would answer. 2539 01:31:43,480 --> 01:31:44,480 All right. 2540 01:31:44,480 --> 01:31:45,480 Let's hear it. 2541 01:31:45,480 --> 01:31:48,480 If you still care, if you actually care, 2542 01:31:48,480 --> 01:31:50,480 if you're just, if you're just challenging me, 2543 01:31:50,480 --> 01:31:53,480 don't, then, but if you care what I think about crypto, 2544 01:31:53,480 --> 01:31:54,480 then I will answer. 2545 01:31:54,480 --> 01:31:55,480 Yeah, I'd love to hear it. 2546 01:31:55,480 --> 01:31:56,480 What are you? 2547 01:31:56,480 --> 01:31:57,480 What are you hard Len? 2548 01:31:57,480 --> 01:31:58,480 My friend. 2549 01:31:58,480 --> 01:31:59,480 What are you hard Len? 2550 01:31:59,480 --> 01:32:00,480 What am I? 2551 01:32:00,480 --> 01:32:01,480 Huddling hurtling? 2552 01:32:01,480 --> 01:32:02,480 I missed that word. 2553 01:32:02,480 --> 01:32:03,480 Huddling. 2554 01:32:03,480 --> 01:32:06,480 It's, it's, it's crypto's fake for holding. 2555 01:32:06,480 --> 01:32:07,480 What, what are you? 2556 01:32:07,480 --> 01:32:08,480 How much crypto do you have? 2557 01:32:08,480 --> 01:32:09,480 Oh, zero. 2558 01:32:09,480 --> 01:32:11,480 I don't care about crypto on the least. 2559 01:32:11,480 --> 01:32:12,480 That's funny. 2560 01:32:12,480 --> 01:32:14,480 So, therefore, less than I have. 2561 01:32:14,480 --> 01:32:16,480 Because I've got 0.0 or something 2562 01:32:16,480 --> 01:32:19,480 of a Bitcoin and like $700 coin. 2563 01:32:19,480 --> 01:32:20,480 No, I give you a little negative. 2564 01:32:20,480 --> 01:32:22,480 It's, and I try to avoid it. 2565 01:32:22,480 --> 01:32:24,480 Okay, there is a little bit of negative crypto I lied. 2566 01:32:24,480 --> 01:32:25,480 That's not true. 2567 01:32:25,480 --> 01:32:29,480 My IRC bros were telling me buy crypto. 2568 01:32:29,480 --> 01:32:30,480 This buy Bitcoin. 2569 01:32:30,480 --> 01:32:31,480 This thing is so cool. 2570 01:32:31,480 --> 01:32:34,480 It's 11 cents and it's going to be worth something someday. 2571 01:32:34,480 --> 01:32:38,480 Even if it's worth a buck, you're a freaking hundred thousand there. 2572 01:32:38,480 --> 01:32:41,480 But they're buy it, buy it, buy it, buy it, buy it. 2573 01:32:41,480 --> 01:32:42,480 And I didn't buy any. 2574 01:32:42,480 --> 01:32:45,480 And that's my one regret regarding crypto currencies. 2575 01:32:45,480 --> 01:32:46,480 The rest I don't give a shit. 2576 01:32:46,480 --> 01:32:47,480 That's my honest answer. 2577 01:32:47,480 --> 01:32:49,480 And, and I respectfully, and giving you the answer 2578 01:32:49,480 --> 01:32:52,480 because I said I would if you answered my question and you did. 2579 01:32:52,480 --> 01:32:53,480 And thank you, Joe. 2580 01:32:53,480 --> 01:32:54,480 I appreciate it. 2581 01:32:54,480 --> 01:32:55,480 I still have another question for the chat, 2582 01:32:55,480 --> 01:32:57,480 but it's an entire subject change. 2583 01:32:57,480 --> 01:33:01,480 Well, that's one of the reasons I stopped listening to the Jupiter shows 2584 01:33:01,480 --> 01:33:04,480 because they seem to be so tied into the crypto aspects 2585 01:33:04,480 --> 01:33:06,480 that it just really turns me off. 2586 01:33:06,480 --> 01:33:09,480 It's like their show doesn't exist without crypto. 2587 01:33:09,480 --> 01:33:12,480 And I used a lot of listening to those guys. 2588 01:33:12,480 --> 01:33:16,480 Yeah, I think I'm personally in agreement with Joe here. 2589 01:33:16,480 --> 01:33:21,480 Like we as a project have fought so hard against crypto. 2590 01:33:21,480 --> 01:33:24,480 And we have put out public statements basically saying 2591 01:33:24,480 --> 01:33:26,480 any suggestion of crypto. 2592 01:33:26,480 --> 01:33:28,480 You have to fork the project to do that. 2593 01:33:28,480 --> 01:33:30,480 We're not, we're not integrated with that. 2594 01:33:30,480 --> 01:33:33,480 But I need to go and do some reading up on podcasting 2.0 2595 01:33:33,480 --> 01:33:36,480 because I really don't understand the sort of spec of it. 2596 01:33:36,480 --> 01:33:39,480 And I wonder how many of the features you could lift 2597 01:33:39,480 --> 01:33:41,480 from podcast 2.0. 2598 01:33:41,480 --> 01:33:43,480 Because you can't lift all of them because it looks like 2599 01:33:43,480 --> 01:33:47,480 some of this is about sort of creating a registry. 2600 01:33:47,480 --> 01:33:50,480 But you could certainly lift some of the technical aspects, 2601 01:33:50,480 --> 01:33:54,480 such as the, you know, the chat to marking and stuff like that. 2602 01:33:54,480 --> 01:33:56,480 You don't need to lift it. 2603 01:33:56,480 --> 01:33:57,480 You don't need to lift it. 2604 01:33:57,480 --> 01:34:01,480 That shit exists already outside of the podcasting 2.0. 2605 01:34:01,480 --> 01:34:05,480 The whole thing is just intimately tied in with crypto bullshit. 2606 01:34:05,480 --> 01:34:07,480 That can just get fucked. 2607 01:34:07,480 --> 01:34:08,480 Yeah, hold on. 2608 01:34:08,480 --> 01:34:10,480 Joe, that's super interesting before he's read it. 2609 01:34:10,480 --> 01:34:13,480 When you're done reading this, you're going to check up on it. 2610 01:34:13,480 --> 01:34:16,480 Will you please come on our podcast on your random and help us with it? 2611 01:34:16,480 --> 01:34:19,480 Tage has read into it and he loved it except for the money part 2612 01:34:19,480 --> 01:34:21,480 and he couldn't stand listening to it. 2613 01:34:21,480 --> 01:34:22,480 Oh, Tage is here. 2614 01:34:22,480 --> 01:34:23,480 Tage, I don't mean to speak for you. 2615 01:34:23,480 --> 01:34:24,480 I'm sorry. 2616 01:34:24,480 --> 01:34:25,480 Yeah. 2617 01:34:25,480 --> 01:34:28,480 I'm looking at this, you know, from the perspective of we need to go back 2618 01:34:28,480 --> 01:34:30,480 into looking at podcasts again. 2619 01:34:30,480 --> 01:34:33,480 I just want, I want to go in and understand. 2620 01:34:33,480 --> 01:34:36,480 Because we have rude, like I say, rudimentary podcasts. 2621 01:34:36,480 --> 01:34:39,480 What we don't have things like chat to mark, isn't that kind of thing? 2622 01:34:39,480 --> 01:34:42,480 But after markers are, you know, awesome. 2623 01:34:42,480 --> 01:34:43,480 Album art is awesome. 2624 01:34:43,480 --> 01:34:47,480 Chapter art is unrigin' believable. 2625 01:34:47,480 --> 01:34:50,480 So you're not something that's different from the pages. 2626 01:34:50,480 --> 01:34:51,480 But that's why it's interesting to me. 2627 01:34:51,480 --> 01:34:53,480 And that's why I'd love if you come on our podcast. 2628 01:34:53,480 --> 01:34:55,480 And now I will show up and let you see what I wish. 2629 01:34:55,480 --> 01:34:58,480 I was just going to say, like, for me, I would agree. 2630 01:34:58,480 --> 01:34:59,480 The biggest contention. 2631 01:34:59,480 --> 01:35:02,480 And we read through castapods, list of features. 2632 01:35:02,480 --> 01:35:04,480 And, you know, we've suggested castapods. 2633 01:35:04,480 --> 01:35:08,480 People who want some of those more, you know, advanced features. 2634 01:35:08,480 --> 01:35:10,480 But we've really put off by the crypto stuff. 2635 01:35:10,480 --> 01:35:15,480 And that's why we don't really recommend recommended too much anymore. 2636 01:35:15,480 --> 01:35:18,480 It's still a step in the right direction in some ways. 2637 01:35:18,480 --> 01:35:22,480 If you're moving away from, like, Spotify's your option for publishing. 2638 01:35:22,480 --> 01:35:24,480 And you say, actually, I'll go with castapod. 2639 01:35:24,480 --> 01:35:26,480 In my opinion, that's a good move. 2640 01:35:26,480 --> 01:35:28,480 But I agree. 2641 01:35:28,480 --> 01:35:31,480 I'm in agreement with, with thing about cryptocurrency. 2642 01:35:31,480 --> 01:35:34,480 But that value for value thing that I'm looking at. 2643 01:35:34,480 --> 01:35:37,480 That's something that you could do, like I say, 2644 01:35:37,480 --> 01:35:41,480 with a traditional payment system backing thing. 2645 01:35:41,480 --> 01:35:43,480 Where you basically just have no interest in. 2646 01:35:43,480 --> 01:35:44,480 No one's interested. 2647 01:35:44,480 --> 01:35:45,480 No one's interested. 2648 01:35:45,480 --> 01:35:46,480 That's the problem. 2649 01:35:46,480 --> 01:35:47,480 No, no, go do it. 2650 01:35:47,480 --> 01:35:48,480 In theory, you could do it. 2651 01:35:48,480 --> 01:35:51,480 But no one wants to pay for shit. 2652 01:35:51,480 --> 01:35:52,480 That's free on the internet. 2653 01:35:52,480 --> 01:35:53,480 Absolutely. 2654 01:35:53,480 --> 01:35:54,480 Exactly for all. 2655 01:35:54,480 --> 01:35:56,480 People who get, you're wrong. 2656 01:35:56,480 --> 01:35:57,480 Okay. 2657 01:35:57,480 --> 01:35:58,480 No, we know this. 2658 01:35:58,480 --> 01:35:59,480 We're not. 2659 01:35:59,480 --> 01:36:00,480 We're not. 2660 01:36:00,480 --> 01:36:01,480 We're not. 2661 01:36:01,480 --> 01:36:02,480 He's not looking for a statistic majority. 2662 01:36:02,480 --> 01:36:04,480 He's looking for enough to get by. 2663 01:36:04,480 --> 01:36:07,480 Or maybe not even him, somebody. 2664 01:36:07,480 --> 01:36:10,480 They're looking for a server cost because they can't afford a server. 2665 01:36:10,480 --> 01:36:13,480 And maybe I'm the only guy that pays and it supports it. 2666 01:36:13,480 --> 01:36:17,480 Or maybe I just throw into the bucket so that the guy who's given it to me doesn't have to give me ads. 2667 01:36:17,480 --> 01:36:18,480 Or whatever other reason. 2668 01:36:18,480 --> 01:36:20,480 It's not where this was going. 2669 01:36:20,480 --> 01:36:21,480 Right, right. 2670 01:36:21,480 --> 01:36:22,480 Yeah, right, right. 2671 01:36:22,480 --> 01:36:24,480 No, no, no, right. 2672 01:36:24,480 --> 01:36:25,480 Yes. 2673 01:36:25,480 --> 01:36:30,480 If by pay for the thing, you mean literally pay for the infrastructure costs of, 2674 01:36:30,480 --> 01:36:35,480 you know, a $5 VPS and maybe a $20 list in account. 2675 01:36:35,480 --> 01:36:36,480 Or whatever else. 2676 01:36:36,480 --> 01:36:38,480 At my day job, I build the internet. 2677 01:36:38,480 --> 01:36:39,480 Yes, I do that too. 2678 01:36:39,480 --> 01:36:41,480 On my personal time. 2679 01:36:41,480 --> 01:36:42,480 And this is what he's talking about. 2680 01:36:42,480 --> 01:36:44,480 Can you let him finish? 2681 01:36:44,480 --> 01:36:46,480 Well, no, because what I'm getting at here is right. 2682 01:36:46,480 --> 01:36:48,480 No, you can't have that. 2683 01:36:48,480 --> 01:36:51,480 No, no, because the problem is that we don't, 2684 01:36:51,480 --> 01:36:55,480 we have not established what paying for something means. 2685 01:36:55,480 --> 01:36:56,480 Right. 2686 01:36:56,480 --> 01:36:58,480 You can pay for the. 2687 01:36:58,480 --> 01:37:01,480 The practical infrastructure. 2688 01:37:01,480 --> 01:37:04,480 That's very nice in the time that we have with the words. 2689 01:37:04,480 --> 01:37:07,480 A lot of to us with the amount of people we have. 2690 01:37:07,480 --> 01:37:09,480 That's way too big of a topic. 2691 01:37:09,480 --> 01:37:10,480 Come on. 2692 01:37:10,480 --> 01:37:13,480 I think that I think that I get what is what's being said here. 2693 01:37:13,480 --> 01:37:18,480 Basically, when you're when I'm what I'm talking about is essentially donations in kind. 2694 01:37:18,480 --> 01:37:22,480 Essentially, you know, give put money into a pot and have that be distributed. 2695 01:37:22,480 --> 01:37:24,480 But that doesn't give you a certain thing. 2696 01:37:24,480 --> 01:37:26,480 You're not actually purchasing something. 2697 01:37:26,480 --> 01:37:29,480 Whereas if you subscribe to a podcast on say, 2698 01:37:29,480 --> 01:37:32,480 Substack or, you know, Patreon, 2699 01:37:32,480 --> 01:37:34,480 you do get something. 2700 01:37:34,480 --> 01:37:35,480 You get an advert free thing. 2701 01:37:35,480 --> 01:37:38,480 Or maybe you get some premium episodes that you don't get elsewhere. 2702 01:37:38,480 --> 01:37:39,480 So I do get that. 2703 01:37:39,480 --> 01:37:43,480 And yeah, that's that's certainly something that, you know, 2704 01:37:43,480 --> 01:37:46,480 I don't think we have a solution to our solution. 2705 01:37:46,480 --> 01:37:50,480 There's more about for those people who are sort of, 2706 01:37:50,480 --> 01:37:53,480 you know, there's sort of people who help pay for a. 2707 01:37:53,480 --> 01:37:56,480 Mastered on server that they use. 2708 01:37:56,480 --> 01:37:59,480 Those generous people who might be willing to, you know, 2709 01:37:59,480 --> 01:38:00,480 basically, uh, 2710 01:38:00,480 --> 01:38:03,480 distribution money between the content that they listen to, 2711 01:38:03,480 --> 01:38:05,480 that be that music or podcasts. 2712 01:38:05,480 --> 01:38:06,480 But I great. 2713 01:38:06,480 --> 01:38:08,480 That wouldn't be enough to make a living off of. 2714 01:38:08,480 --> 01:38:09,480 And that's why I was asking you, 2715 01:38:09,480 --> 01:38:11,480 actually, Joe, about the, um, 2716 01:38:11,480 --> 01:38:13,480 how do that, how do your ad reads work? 2717 01:38:13,480 --> 01:38:14,480 Because, you know, 2718 01:38:14,480 --> 01:38:18,480 we need to think about other ways that we can help with that kind of thing. 2719 01:38:18,480 --> 01:38:19,480 How do you work with it? 2720 01:38:19,480 --> 01:38:21,480 We're very much for, 2721 01:38:21,480 --> 01:38:23,480 uh, 2722 01:38:23,480 --> 01:38:25,480 because I wasn't sure how the, um, 2723 01:38:25,480 --> 01:38:27,480 how the sort of payouts or ad reads work, 2724 01:38:27,480 --> 01:38:29,480 how the, um, you know, 2725 01:38:29,480 --> 01:38:31,480 how the actual sets up for that works. 2726 01:38:31,480 --> 01:38:32,480 But I'd know, I guess. 2727 01:38:32,480 --> 01:38:33,480 Yeah. 2728 01:38:33,480 --> 01:38:35,480 We're, um, 2729 01:38:35,480 --> 01:38:39,480 but we're a platform for hobbyists at the end of the day when it comes to podcast. 2730 01:38:39,480 --> 01:38:41,480 So we're much more about music. 2731 01:38:41,480 --> 01:38:43,480 And there's a different challenge to, uh, 2732 01:38:43,480 --> 01:38:44,480 selling music. 2733 01:38:44,480 --> 01:38:47,480 And there is to make money for podcasts because, again, 2734 01:38:47,480 --> 01:38:49,480 music you get a deliverable, 2735 01:38:49,480 --> 01:38:51,480 and where else with, uh, you know, 2736 01:38:51,480 --> 01:38:52,480 and we have to think about that, 2737 01:38:52,480 --> 01:38:55,480 because we don't really want to put paywalls in front of music either. 2738 01:38:55,480 --> 01:38:56,480 But, you know, that. 2739 01:38:56,480 --> 01:38:57,480 There's a thing. 2740 01:38:57,480 --> 01:38:58,480 Hang on, hang on, hang on. 2741 01:38:58,480 --> 01:38:59,480 Are you telling the point? 2742 01:38:59,480 --> 01:39:00,480 Just so awful. 2743 01:39:00,480 --> 01:39:01,480 No, no, no, wait. 2744 01:39:01,480 --> 01:39:01,480 When, when, when, 2745 01:39:01,480 --> 01:39:03,480 what interactive point real quick with music, 2746 01:39:03,480 --> 01:39:05,480 it is so deliverable. 2747 01:39:05,480 --> 01:39:09,480 I have anticipation on my way to the internet to go by music. 2748 01:39:09,480 --> 01:39:11,480 It's, it's really deliverable. 2749 01:39:11,480 --> 01:39:12,480 Hang on. 2750 01:39:12,480 --> 01:39:13,480 Hang on. 2751 01:39:13,480 --> 01:39:15,480 So you tell me that music is deliverable, right? 2752 01:39:15,480 --> 01:39:18,480 So let's say AC DC ends up a new album. 2753 01:39:18,480 --> 01:39:23,480 It's deliverable in a way that podcasting hasn't figured out yet. 2754 01:39:23,480 --> 01:39:26,480 Podcasting is absolutely that deliverable. 2755 01:39:26,480 --> 01:39:28,480 We just haven't figured it out. 2756 01:39:28,480 --> 01:39:29,480 Yeah. 2757 01:39:29,480 --> 01:39:32,480 No, I think the difference is, and it's historical. 2758 01:39:32,480 --> 01:39:34,480 I think the difference is largely historical. 2759 01:39:34,480 --> 01:39:38,480 Um, like you say, you have anticipation of buying the new album from AC DC, 2760 01:39:38,480 --> 01:39:39,480 and that's great. 2761 01:39:39,480 --> 01:39:42,480 Whereas podcasts have historically always been essentially free access 2762 01:39:42,480 --> 01:39:46,480 through easily accessible software using a standard RSS feed. 2763 01:39:46,480 --> 01:39:50,480 And so people being, you know, they're like, I can get podcasts for free, 2764 01:39:50,480 --> 01:39:53,480 and then suddenly the idea that they might have to pay for them, 2765 01:39:53,480 --> 01:39:55,480 they find that difficult. 2766 01:39:55,480 --> 01:39:57,480 Whereas music, they've always paid for it. 2767 01:39:57,480 --> 01:39:58,480 That's baked in. 2768 01:39:58,480 --> 01:39:59,480 It's called growing up. 2769 01:39:59,480 --> 01:40:02,480 Well, let, let, let me get a little bit political here, right? 2770 01:40:02,480 --> 01:40:06,480 Podcasts are free at the point of service. 2771 01:40:06,480 --> 01:40:09,480 That doesn't mean they're free because someone's got a pay for it. 2772 01:40:09,480 --> 01:40:11,480 And, uh, this is something that we just... 2773 01:40:11,480 --> 01:40:12,480 Yeah, joke, joke. 2774 01:40:12,480 --> 01:40:14,480 It sounds a lot like it. 2775 01:40:14,480 --> 01:40:15,480 It just doesn't it. 2776 01:40:15,480 --> 01:40:17,480 Joe, you're preaching to the choir. 2777 01:40:17,480 --> 01:40:21,480 We all understand that you don't need to say it as if we disagree with you. 2778 01:40:21,480 --> 01:40:22,480 We get that. 2779 01:40:22,480 --> 01:40:25,480 We're on the same page at this point, and it sounds aggressive. 2780 01:40:25,480 --> 01:40:27,480 To me, maybe I'm just hearing it wrong. 2781 01:40:27,480 --> 01:40:29,480 And if so, I apologize for interrupting. 2782 01:40:29,480 --> 01:40:35,480 Well, it just seems to me that you've got a bunch of people who are happy to make podcasts 2783 01:40:35,480 --> 01:40:36,480 as a hobby, right? 2784 01:40:36,480 --> 01:40:38,480 Which is totally cold, like great. 2785 01:40:38,480 --> 01:40:41,480 And, you know, they want to make a few bucks out of it 2786 01:40:41,480 --> 01:40:44,480 to sort of kind of cover their expenses and maybe even cover their time. 2787 01:40:44,480 --> 01:40:49,480 But, you know, if you're spending, you know, say two hours every couple of weeks 2788 01:40:49,480 --> 01:40:52,480 to get together with some friends record it, 2789 01:40:52,480 --> 01:40:55,480 and, you know, like, maybe do a little bit of an audacity 2790 01:40:55,480 --> 01:40:58,480 and then export it, upload it somewhere, and publish it. 2791 01:40:58,480 --> 01:41:03,480 And, you know, that's, you know, you may be making a couple of hundred bucks a month 2792 01:41:03,480 --> 01:41:06,480 or, you know, you're bringing in a hundred couple hundred bucks a month. 2793 01:41:06,480 --> 01:41:11,480 That's covering your hosting costs and it's paying everyone a beer money, whatever. 2794 01:41:11,480 --> 01:41:14,480 And that's cool, right? But that's just not what I'm trying to do here. 2795 01:41:14,480 --> 01:41:19,480 I'm trying to do this as a living, and it's just a different situation 2796 01:41:19,480 --> 01:41:23,480 and it's, it's very hard in the Linux and open source world 2797 01:41:23,480 --> 01:41:27,480 to make people understand that that you can't, 2798 01:41:27,480 --> 01:41:31,480 and this applies to open source projects as well. 2799 01:41:31,480 --> 01:41:36,480 You've got certain projects that haven't been updated for years and years and years, right? 2800 01:41:36,480 --> 01:41:38,480 Because you're, okay? 2801 01:41:38,480 --> 01:41:43,480 You sound really guilty, but what you're saying doesn't sound worthy of guilt. 2802 01:41:43,480 --> 01:41:44,480 It's not what you're doing. 2803 01:41:44,480 --> 01:41:44,480 It's not what you're doing. 2804 01:41:44,480 --> 01:41:45,480 It's not what you're doing. 2805 01:41:45,480 --> 01:41:46,480 It's not what you're doing. 2806 01:41:46,480 --> 01:41:47,480 It's something you want to keep. 2807 01:41:47,480 --> 01:41:49,480 No, yes, yes, yes. 2808 01:41:49,480 --> 01:41:51,480 I really don't think it opens or it's. 2809 01:41:51,480 --> 01:41:53,480 Yes, I wasn't sure I'm gonna be able to. 2810 01:41:53,480 --> 01:41:56,480 I'm trying to say that like you sound, you, it's, 2811 01:41:56,480 --> 01:41:57,480 it's, it's guilt. 2812 01:41:57,480 --> 01:42:00,480 Yes, I, I, I don't think it's, defensive. 2813 01:42:00,480 --> 01:42:02,480 Maybe defensive is the weapon. 2814 01:42:02,480 --> 01:42:05,480 Yeah, okay, no defensive. 2815 01:42:05,480 --> 01:42:06,480 I don't understand. 2816 01:42:06,480 --> 01:42:10,480 But in, the difference there is that, I would, you're among, 2817 01:42:10,480 --> 01:42:12,480 I mean, I know you don't get along with, 2818 01:42:12,480 --> 01:42:15,480 is that, you know, I'll go back to the pronunciation. 2819 01:42:15,480 --> 01:42:16,480 I know you'll get along with them. 2820 01:42:16,480 --> 01:42:17,480 It's pronounced. 2821 01:42:17,480 --> 01:42:19,480 Mass, and OSS. 2822 01:42:19,480 --> 01:42:20,480 Okay. 2823 01:42:20,480 --> 01:42:21,480 Mass, okay. 2824 01:42:21,480 --> 01:42:23,480 I understand you don't get along with them. 2825 01:42:23,480 --> 01:42:25,480 He still sounds like your friend. 2826 01:42:25,480 --> 01:42:26,480 I don't have any problems with opinion. 2827 01:42:26,480 --> 01:42:28,480 I just, that's about it. 2828 01:42:28,480 --> 01:42:31,480 I don't have a problem with the model, Joe. 2829 01:42:31,480 --> 01:42:33,480 I know you need to make money. 2830 01:42:33,480 --> 01:42:34,480 I don't have a problem with that. 2831 01:42:34,480 --> 01:42:37,480 I just don't think that because I advertise 2832 01:42:37,480 --> 01:42:39,480 one of my podcasts as being, 2833 01:42:39,480 --> 01:42:40,480 no ads, no BS. 2834 01:42:40,480 --> 01:42:44,480 It doesn't mean I'm calling your product bad. 2835 01:42:44,480 --> 01:42:47,480 It just means I'm calling my product what it is. 2836 01:42:47,480 --> 01:42:48,480 Okay. 2837 01:42:48,480 --> 01:42:50,480 So no, no ads is in one circle, 2838 01:42:50,480 --> 01:42:51,480 and no BS is in another. 2839 01:42:51,480 --> 01:42:53,480 And, and Joe, you don't fall within the, 2840 01:42:53,480 --> 01:42:55,480 the Zen overlap. 2841 01:42:55,480 --> 01:42:57,480 You never, he never meant to attend the truth. 2842 01:42:57,480 --> 01:42:58,480 I did. 2843 01:42:58,480 --> 01:43:00,480 If anybody listens to this, 2844 01:43:00,480 --> 01:43:03,480 thinks that no ads are nor BS. 2845 01:43:03,480 --> 01:43:07,480 It's not an attack on people who have ads in their shows. 2846 01:43:07,480 --> 01:43:09,480 Then, good luck. 2847 01:43:09,480 --> 01:43:12,480 Good luck with the critical thinking and the rest of it. 2848 01:43:12,480 --> 01:43:15,480 That comes to my house. 2849 01:43:15,480 --> 01:43:17,480 No, listen, listen to me. 2850 01:43:17,480 --> 01:43:20,480 To come to my house, my fucking house, 2851 01:43:20,480 --> 01:43:21,480 my telegram group, 2852 01:43:21,480 --> 01:43:23,480 and advertise your podcast, 2853 01:43:23,480 --> 01:43:25,480 as having no ads of no BS, 2854 01:43:25,480 --> 01:43:27,480 gets your band from my telegram group. 2855 01:43:27,480 --> 01:43:28,480 So, right? 2856 01:43:28,480 --> 01:43:29,480 No, no, no. 2857 01:43:29,480 --> 01:43:30,480 He said it in wrong place, 2858 01:43:30,480 --> 01:43:32,480 and then we had a conversation about it. 2859 01:43:32,480 --> 01:43:33,480 And then he doubled down on it, 2860 01:43:33,480 --> 01:43:34,480 and he can get fucked. 2861 01:43:34,480 --> 01:43:35,480 Okay. 2862 01:43:35,480 --> 01:43:36,480 Okay. 2863 01:43:36,480 --> 01:43:37,480 And all of you can get fucked, 2864 01:43:37,480 --> 01:43:38,480 because I'm just done with this. 2865 01:43:38,480 --> 01:43:39,480 He don't tell me to get fucked. 2866 01:43:39,480 --> 01:43:41,480 I'm trying to understand you, 2867 01:43:41,480 --> 01:43:42,480 and I, all right, 2868 01:43:42,480 --> 01:43:43,480 up. 2869 01:43:43,480 --> 01:43:44,480 Mass. 2870 01:43:44,480 --> 01:43:45,480 Yep. 2871 01:43:45,480 --> 01:43:47,480 That's my arrest for the night. 2872 01:43:47,480 --> 01:43:48,480 Dude, you said it in the wrong place, 2873 01:43:48,480 --> 01:43:49,480 and you shouldn't have doubled down. 2874 01:43:49,480 --> 01:43:50,480 I did the same thing myself. 2875 01:43:50,480 --> 01:43:52,480 He was, he was asking people 2876 01:43:52,480 --> 01:43:55,480 to advertise their podcasts on his show. 2877 01:43:55,480 --> 01:43:56,480 My podcast, 2878 01:43:56,480 --> 01:43:59,480 I, I was not saying anything about his podcast 2879 01:43:59,480 --> 01:44:01,480 being bad or wrong in any way. 2880 01:44:01,480 --> 01:44:02,480 I was just saying, 2881 01:44:02,480 --> 01:44:04,480 my podcast has no ads, 2882 01:44:04,480 --> 01:44:05,480 no BS. 2883 01:44:05,480 --> 01:44:07,480 It's a less than 10 minute podcast 2884 01:44:07,480 --> 01:44:08,480 of the weeks. 2885 01:44:08,480 --> 01:44:09,480 Learning said open source news. 2886 01:44:09,480 --> 01:44:11,480 But I don't have time to get along. 2887 01:44:11,480 --> 01:44:12,480 I can't get it. 2888 01:44:12,480 --> 01:44:13,480 Sorry. 2889 01:44:13,480 --> 01:44:15,480 Sorry. 2890 01:44:15,480 --> 01:44:17,480 I was very angry, 2891 01:44:17,480 --> 01:44:19,480 and also happened to be in a dead zone there. 2892 01:44:19,480 --> 01:44:20,480 Sorry. 2893 01:44:20,480 --> 01:44:21,480 Fucking 3G sucks. 2894 01:44:21,480 --> 01:44:23,480 It's not even 4G here. 2895 01:44:23,480 --> 01:44:24,480 So I, 2896 01:44:24,480 --> 01:44:25,480 maybe breaking up. 2897 01:44:25,480 --> 01:44:26,480 Sorry. 2898 01:44:26,480 --> 01:44:27,480 I didn't believe that. 2899 01:44:27,480 --> 01:44:28,480 I just, 2900 01:44:28,480 --> 01:44:29,480 that was shitty timing. 2901 01:44:29,480 --> 01:44:30,480 Sorry. 2902 01:44:30,480 --> 01:44:31,480 And it was the first time. 2903 01:44:31,480 --> 01:44:32,480 It's not going to be perfect. 2904 01:44:32,480 --> 01:44:33,480 Thanks. 2905 01:44:33,480 --> 01:44:34,480 Hey. 2906 01:44:34,480 --> 01:44:35,480 Okay. 2907 01:44:35,480 --> 01:44:36,480 May I for just a moment? 2908 01:44:36,480 --> 01:44:37,480 A wicked drunk. 2909 01:44:37,480 --> 01:44:38,480 I need to say, 2910 01:44:38,480 --> 01:44:39,480 I love you guys. 2911 01:44:39,480 --> 01:44:40,480 I love this conversation. 2912 01:44:40,480 --> 01:44:42,480 I understand. 2913 01:44:42,480 --> 01:44:43,480 What is it? 2914 01:44:43,480 --> 01:44:44,480 Moved spell it. 2915 01:44:44,480 --> 01:44:45,480 Mosh. 2916 01:44:45,480 --> 01:44:46,480 Mosh. 2917 01:44:46,480 --> 01:44:47,480 Yes. 2918 01:44:47,480 --> 01:44:47,480 Okay. 2919 01:44:47,480 --> 01:44:48,480 Mosh. 2920 01:44:48,480 --> 01:44:49,480 You made a great point. 2921 01:44:49,480 --> 01:44:50,480 You did it in the wrong place. 2922 01:44:50,480 --> 01:44:52,480 He let you know it was not in the wrong place. 2923 01:44:52,480 --> 01:44:53,480 And instead of saying sorry, 2924 01:44:53,480 --> 01:44:54,480 you know, 2925 01:44:54,480 --> 01:44:55,480 next time I'll try to do it better, 2926 01:44:55,480 --> 01:44:56,480 you doubled down. 2927 01:44:56,480 --> 01:44:57,480 I've done the same thing. 2928 01:44:57,480 --> 01:44:58,480 I don't know. 2929 01:44:58,480 --> 01:45:00,480 Maybe I'll get it double down. 2930 01:45:00,480 --> 01:45:02,480 I feel like he just went on slamming me. 2931 01:45:02,480 --> 01:45:03,480 What doesn't matter. 2932 01:45:03,480 --> 01:45:04,480 Do you think about what can you say? 2933 01:45:04,480 --> 01:45:05,480 Just, 2934 01:45:05,480 --> 01:45:07,480 Even if that move on from there. 2935 01:45:07,480 --> 01:45:08,480 Yeah. 2936 01:45:08,480 --> 01:45:09,480 He thinks you doubled down. 2937 01:45:09,480 --> 01:45:09,480 Whether or not you've, 2938 01:45:09,480 --> 01:45:10,480 you've meant to, 2939 01:45:10,480 --> 01:45:12,480 he's not questioning your intention. 2940 01:45:12,480 --> 01:45:14,480 You doubled down in the wrong place. 2941 01:45:14,480 --> 01:45:17,480 And he was just saying it was not the right place to do it. 2942 01:45:17,480 --> 01:45:19,480 If we can agree that it was the wrong place, 2943 01:45:19,480 --> 01:45:21,480 I totally agree with the point that you made. 2944 01:45:21,480 --> 01:45:23,480 It's what we've all been talking about all night. 2945 01:45:23,480 --> 01:45:24,480 It's. 2946 01:45:24,480 --> 01:45:25,480 He's even saying the same damn thing. 2947 01:45:25,480 --> 01:45:27,480 It was just the wrong way to say, 2948 01:45:27,480 --> 01:45:32,920 way to say it in the wrong place. Thank you. Exactly, yes. Thank you for 2949 01:45:32,920 --> 01:45:38,280 summoning it up, brilliantly. Who hit me? Yes, you. I'm sorry. I just 2950 01:45:38,280 --> 01:45:43,400 summed up your submarine. No, that's all. The both of you summed it up between 2951 01:45:43,400 --> 01:45:46,440 you, brilliantly. Yes, it was the wrong thing to say in the wrong 2952 01:45:46,440 --> 01:45:51,960 place and in a different venue could have been much better handle and 2953 01:45:51,960 --> 01:45:56,760 like this is definitely not the right venue for that for this whole thing either. 2954 01:45:56,760 --> 01:46:06,840 I'm sorry for bringing it up as well. I'm sorry. Cool. See, now I think we're in the right 2955 01:46:06,840 --> 01:46:11,480 frame of mind. It may be Joe and I hit it off. We're in the right frame of mind for team 2956 01:46:11,480 --> 01:46:15,880 building and for love and for sharing love for one another. Bridge building, excuse me, 2957 01:46:15,880 --> 01:46:24,120 that's we're in the right frame of mind. I am Joe, what about you? I'm sure. Yeah, but you are a 2958 01:46:24,120 --> 01:46:31,480 brilliant, fucking diplomat, is all I could say. Here, Joe, are you open to working? Are you open 2959 01:46:31,480 --> 01:46:36,280 to working for the British government because we need some? We really, really don't. Can you 2960 01:46:36,280 --> 01:46:41,240 please talk to Europe and fix that whole situation because we need a good diplomat like you? 2961 01:46:41,240 --> 01:46:48,920 Which whole situation? All of them, please. No, it's not. Is it the cabbage situation? I thought 2962 01:46:48,920 --> 01:46:54,360 there was already handled. That's the one. It's a lettuce and yeah, it's a big, it's a lettuce. Oh, my 2963 01:46:54,360 --> 01:47:00,680 favorite one was the flitching episode in Holland. So y'all want to know what I just finished up? 2964 01:47:01,240 --> 01:47:08,600 Yep, as long as it changes the subject. AK74, a short barrel, a pistol technically, 2965 01:47:08,600 --> 01:47:18,120 and a 556. Cool. Those are ridiculous. Oh, which 555 weapons? Like, we'll take the same ammo as, um, 2966 01:47:18,120 --> 01:47:28,360 what, um, the M16 M4? Yes, that's a 556, it's a 223. Well, 556 is, is 556 is a federal, the NATO 2967 01:47:28,360 --> 01:47:34,440 round, and 556 will not go into a 223, but 223 will fall into a 556 just fine. 2968 01:47:34,440 --> 01:47:40,040 Cool. But it's still a ridiculous weapon, and it's like, I wouldn't have made the same. 2969 01:47:40,040 --> 01:47:45,320 You've still using a rifle round, yeah, it's correct. And a rifle, well, it's short barrel, 2970 01:47:45,320 --> 01:47:50,680 though. That's the only bandage, which makes it just twice as hard to control. It negates all the 2971 01:47:50,680 --> 01:47:55,400 advantages. Well, if you're saying the M16 is better than the M4 because it's got a longer barrel? 2972 01:47:55,400 --> 01:48:02,440 No, I'm saying no. No, I'm saying a rifle round without a shoulder stock is very difficult to control. 2973 01:48:02,440 --> 01:48:09,640 Ah, okay. I mean, I can hold, uh, one inch groups at uh, 50 yards. Oh, like, 2974 01:48:09,640 --> 01:48:14,120 oh, there's some other stuff in the top of a cylinder block wall, because that's the only place 2975 01:48:14,120 --> 01:48:19,160 where you would want to use that weapon. Or are you staying still? Hold it, stand in a 2976 01:48:19,160 --> 01:48:27,160 supply area. Sorry, that's right, but this one is pretty up. Sorry, I'm trying to break in here 2977 01:48:27,160 --> 01:48:31,560 with it, just the worst mobile connection ever. So, sorry, I think I'm going to have to drop out 2978 01:48:31,560 --> 01:48:35,560 because it's just dropping out all the time and packet loss and everything. I've just got the 2979 01:48:35,560 --> 01:48:39,560 work. I think everyone's just on their phones because this new year's eve or whatever, even I'm in 2980 01:48:39,560 --> 01:48:45,720 London. No, it was great. Yeah, it was great. Yeah. Okay, well, it's kind of dropping in us. 2981 01:48:45,720 --> 01:48:51,640 So, uh, I'll keep listening for a bit, but uh, yeah, it was great to talk to everyone. And uh, 2982 01:48:51,640 --> 01:48:58,120 yeah, it's pretty true. I guess next year. Joe, one last thing, if you, if we don't speak again, 2983 01:48:58,120 --> 01:49:01,080 I still have my question for you that I posted in the chat. Doesn't have to be here, 2984 01:49:01,080 --> 01:49:05,400 but I got a question for you. I'm sorry, I'm not like, it's this mobile kind of plumbel 2985 01:49:05,400 --> 01:49:10,120 of, uh, asteroid isn't great for that sort of thing. What was the question, uh, briefly? 2986 01:49:10,120 --> 01:49:15,480 Yeah, you just answered it, actually. Oh, was it what client I'm using? Yes, thank you. 2987 01:49:15,480 --> 01:49:20,440 Yeah, plumbel, sorry. Yeah, it's, uh, the client is great, but just my connection is terrible tonight. 2988 01:49:20,440 --> 01:49:26,360 Usually it's great out here, but the number of cars and everything, uh, it's, it's, it's not 2989 01:49:26,360 --> 01:49:31,160 the client, it's my connection. I know, I've had problems all night. It's just a very busy night 2990 01:49:31,160 --> 01:49:35,880 for London. So, uh, what do you, what do you think for, uh, we have to wear an 2991 01:49:35,880 --> 01:49:42,200 announcement when you're, someone needs to do a new year announcement. When we all do it, 2992 01:49:42,200 --> 01:49:49,400 three, two, one, half, half a year. I don't have to do it at the time, don't 2993 01:49:49,400 --> 01:49:57,400 do it at all. It's still in the middle of the Atlantic. Um, next hour will be at 2994 01:49:57,400 --> 01:50:03,320 lag time, which is New Brunswick and, and Newfoundland. And the hour after that is Eastern time, 2995 01:50:03,320 --> 01:50:09,640 U.S. Actually, the, anyway, somewhere is, yeah, it doesn't take my beeper zill or not, 2996 01:50:09,640 --> 01:50:14,680 today. And then I think you found them half an hour. Yeah, but that's a missed an hour from now. 2997 01:50:14,680 --> 01:50:21,400 No, then the new family. Yeah, no family. Oh, a phyauton's in. Yeah. Oh, 2998 01:50:21,400 --> 01:50:28,920 you have these are so cool and weird. And then New Brunswick and uh, Nova Scotia are in one hour. 2999 01:50:28,920 --> 01:50:34,520 Well, I completely flubbed all announcing, we're all in North Carolina because uh, yeah, for some reason, 3000 01:50:34,520 --> 01:50:39,080 I thought there was flowers. Yeah, I thought I was a later in this. Oh, I thought you just, 3001 01:50:39,080 --> 01:50:51,560 you were too sober. I mean, I'm dead sober because like, I've just been working on a weapon. 3002 01:50:51,560 --> 01:50:56,600 And I don't do that trunk. Oh, yeah, that makes sense. Let's see. Actually, that's not just, 3003 01:50:56,600 --> 01:51:01,160 that's best policy. That is the best rack that's that's going to be real hard to improve on that one 3004 01:51:01,160 --> 01:51:10,040 folks. Uh, improve on. Yeah, but once again, I've mentioned Iowa, where the state sport is drinking 3005 01:51:10,040 --> 01:51:15,240 and driving, but you know, the hobby on the side of that is taking your sugar rifle with you 3006 01:51:15,240 --> 01:51:21,080 and hunting from out the window. Wow, both of those things suck. You know what's awesome? 3007 01:51:21,080 --> 01:51:24,920 Up in this neck of the woods, what we do is get drunk in the front yard. And when red and 3008 01:51:24,920 --> 01:51:31,640 next go flying by, like doing jumps on your street, you go woo, woo, woo, woo, woo. And the 12 year old 3009 01:51:31,640 --> 01:51:37,880 raises the Miller light atcha. Yeah, but that seems logical. You know, it's fun here is uh, 3010 01:51:37,880 --> 01:51:44,840 local cops getting drunk and uh, smashing up their uh, cars. Oh, they're El Camino. It's 3011 01:51:44,840 --> 01:51:50,600 those cops got El Camino's. Why don't we just smash up in El Camino? Uh, they're El Camino's here. 3012 01:51:50,600 --> 01:51:57,880 Yes, and pirate. Yes, and they're driven on and fucking forward uh, shit explorers. 3013 01:51:58,440 --> 01:52:02,600 Anyways, so we more about the pistol you made. Uh, well, it's uh, 3014 01:52:02,600 --> 01:52:08,280 shoulders receiver, uh, WPP pull in parts. Uh, what is it? You know, 3015 01:52:08,280 --> 01:52:13,240 you'll know. What is our shoulders receiver? What is this receiver better than a stamp steel 3016 01:52:13,240 --> 01:52:20,040 one that collashnikov chat out on his birthday? Oh, it's it is a stamped steel one. It's just 3017 01:52:20,040 --> 01:52:25,000 uh, you know, it's just, it's just has a nice made in USA on it. So it's easier to deal with 3018 01:52:25,000 --> 01:52:29,880 regulations. Did the main USA get stamped into the receiver when the receiver was stamped 3019 01:52:29,880 --> 01:52:36,440 or is it like laser cut? Uh, well, uh, the, it is my understanding that the basic stamping was 3020 01:52:36,440 --> 01:52:42,680 done in Poland as a flat and then it was shaped here and then this dude named, there's place called 3021 01:52:42,680 --> 01:52:49,720 shoulders. Like, they're places in Germany, maybe in USA. Anyway, well, it's like, you know, 3022 01:52:49,720 --> 01:52:54,920 anything else. Like, if you do the final finishing steps in the USA, the NAICALS is made in USA. 3023 01:52:54,920 --> 01:52:59,960 Yeah, but so that about half the city buses in America are made in Canada. They just do the 3024 01:52:59,960 --> 01:53:05,800 finishing work in Buffalo. Yeah, it's like, you bolt the, no, you bolt the holes on and Buffalo 3025 01:53:05,800 --> 01:53:10,520 and you get to stamp made in USA on it. No, that doesn't work for someone named pirate. 3026 01:53:10,520 --> 01:53:18,360 You said you bought it because it says, it's the laser at, made in USA on it. I asked you what 3027 01:53:18,360 --> 01:53:25,240 the advantage of it was over the one that Colashnikov shot out on his birthday. No, it's basically 3028 01:53:25,240 --> 01:53:30,360 a clone. And because he shot it out in his birthday, someone should go edit Wikipedia and then it 3029 01:53:30,360 --> 01:53:36,040 will become true as long as they reference us. I thought everything in Wikipedia was true. 3030 01:53:36,040 --> 01:53:41,960 That's what I just said. So Mo, Mo, Mo, Mo, you got to learn to agree with people better. 3031 01:53:41,960 --> 01:53:47,560 Boss, boss, my coffee, but instead of his name, wrong, every single time. 3032 01:53:47,560 --> 01:53:53,240 Because he spelled it phonetically and it was not an M or an O or an O or an S. 3033 01:53:53,240 --> 01:54:00,360 It's an I will use the same thing as boss. It's just in Sanskrit. So, 3034 01:54:00,360 --> 01:54:06,680 but it's not in all this way. Honestly, did not pronounce it myself. All right, all right, 3035 01:54:06,680 --> 01:54:11,400 I will handle the Zaivalananda which means most bliss. I'm changing my answer. 3036 01:54:11,400 --> 01:54:14,760 I managed to get it wrong every time because I'm an idiot. Final answer. 3037 01:54:16,280 --> 01:54:20,760 Well, you said I don't want to know what it means. I try to be nice idiot. Do I know what what 3038 01:54:20,760 --> 01:54:26,760 means? It's for her. No, but I'd like to. It means absolutely nothing. I made it up. Do you know what 3039 01:54:26,760 --> 01:54:33,720 Joe means? Coffee. Coffee, yeah. Well, actually, it also means a GI of American soldiers. 3040 01:54:33,720 --> 01:54:37,160 Well, I've been there, too. But no, it actually means... 3041 01:54:37,160 --> 01:54:41,720 He has the vote. He also blew it. You've got walked on Joe, can you say? 3042 01:54:41,720 --> 01:54:47,080 I'm sorry. Joe means gift from God. Oh, yeah, right on. My son's name was Jacob. 3043 01:54:47,080 --> 01:54:53,080 Yeah. My name is my name is my first name is actually Kiron, which is an Irish name, 3044 01:54:53,080 --> 01:54:58,120 meaning the little dock one, but I'm 181 centimeters tall and blonde, so I don't know what's 3045 01:54:58,120 --> 01:55:02,920 happening there. Well, careful that it ain't your heart. Just don't look, you know. It's like 3046 01:55:02,920 --> 01:55:08,920 a one-eye open. It's okay. I got it. What is your daughter, Tala here? And her name means little wolf. 3047 01:55:08,920 --> 01:55:14,440 What is that in real inches? It's six foot one inch. Oh, not bad. 3048 01:55:14,440 --> 01:55:21,080 Means what? Talking wolf. Okay. I got it wrong. Oh, two socks. Like from the answers or 3049 01:55:21,080 --> 01:55:24,520 wolves. Oh, hold on. You can talk to Tala for a second. I'm going to lift some everything. 3050 01:55:25,800 --> 01:55:33,720 Hold on. Joe does a lot of weight lifting. Oh. Hey, Tala? Hi. Yeah. Joe said that you're shorter 3051 01:55:33,720 --> 01:55:40,200 because he named you Tala and he's sorry. He's a liar. He was too sorry for that. 3052 01:55:43,720 --> 01:55:49,160 Shit, I just get him. Hi, Tala. It's Moss. You know me from the other podcasts. Hi, Moss. 3053 01:55:49,160 --> 01:55:54,520 It's a pleasure to hear you. Thank you. Good to hear you, too. You're the cleverest kid I've 3054 01:55:54,520 --> 01:55:59,000 talked to all day. Thank you. I'll be it. I'm going to talk now. So I'm big. 3055 01:55:59,720 --> 01:56:03,800 What for your age, I meant for your I talked to a eight year old who was just brilliant all 3056 01:56:03,800 --> 01:56:09,720 so for your age. Thank you, sir. So what kind of lies has my father been telling you? 3057 01:56:09,720 --> 01:56:15,240 I got three sisters up out here. Oh, no, we're not going to give him. We're not going to give that up, 3058 01:56:15,240 --> 01:56:20,680 on, Joe. He said soft. I shouldn't be free with a capital F. He said only with a lower case of 3059 01:56:20,680 --> 01:56:31,560 he said that software. He said that software should only be free with a lower case F, but never with a 3060 01:56:31,560 --> 01:56:38,920 capital F. Yeah, he said. He said. He made something even less. He's Windows. He said. He made you 3061 01:56:38,920 --> 01:56:49,640 even less. He spelled Windows without a Z. That was the lie he told. But a horrible person. 3062 01:56:50,280 --> 01:56:56,120 No, we know he's your father. You got to forgive him. No, he's on the path. He's on the path 3063 01:56:56,120 --> 01:57:03,240 through this. We're working with him. Even if you don't forgive him now, just at least wait till 3064 01:57:03,240 --> 01:57:07,240 we're done with him. Well, right now he's just on the weight bench, which is not quite the path 3065 01:57:07,240 --> 01:57:14,600 to redemption. I don't know. He's pretty enough to get away with it. You don't want to be on the 3066 01:57:14,600 --> 01:57:21,160 weight bench if moss is your spotter. He is not. We'll say physically reliable for that situation. 3067 01:57:21,160 --> 01:57:26,680 I'm too old for that. They're slandering you. No, I'm too old for two. You don't want me to be 3068 01:57:26,680 --> 01:57:31,960 there neither. No, I'm blessed. This guy's a sweetheart. It's only slander if it's a lie. 3069 01:57:31,960 --> 01:57:41,640 Have I heard your voice before my dear? Uh, probably. I tend to try and interrupt his peacetime, 3070 01:57:41,640 --> 01:57:47,880 which is mostly when he talks to you. Would you be the not tall person? Yes. I am the rather 3071 01:57:47,880 --> 01:57:52,920 short person with the tall name. Yes, that's she's an entirely associate got short. He 3072 01:57:52,920 --> 01:58:00,840 okay, then he owes you an apology. How about that? I will, we'll just call you shorty. I have been 3073 01:58:01,560 --> 01:58:10,200 I have been delighted by hearing, I believe, you're, or somebody cut out a recording of your 3074 01:58:10,200 --> 01:58:14,520 voice and gave it to me some years ago. Unfortunately, it's not on their system. 3075 01:58:14,520 --> 01:58:20,040 Oh, you're talking about my sister. Can I? The one where it's the I am short? It's hard to keep 3076 01:58:20,040 --> 01:58:26,120 crack of all the beauties in your family, you know. Oh, you're going to make me plush. That was the 3077 01:58:26,120 --> 01:58:36,680 idea. Yeah, he was told to my sister. Did he give you his both I write names? I am a preemptively. 3078 01:58:38,200 --> 01:58:45,320 I'm on the East Coast, so I think we're at a safe distance for platonic relationship. I feel like 3079 01:58:45,320 --> 01:58:51,240 that works. I think my dad might, you know, get a little angry at any other way. He's like, 3080 01:58:51,240 --> 01:58:56,040 as long as there are two states away. Yo, net minor, East Coast is all on the same 3081 01:58:56,040 --> 01:59:02,360 tectonic plate, so those platonic relationships are still really, really like, yeah, well, 3082 01:59:02,360 --> 01:59:10,360 emanating. But Joe's in Texas, that doesn't count. Yeah, sorry, Texas is like a cryptid. We're stuck here. 3083 01:59:10,360 --> 01:59:17,080 No, so that's cool. So there's at least a lot of time in the bite of behaviorism. So the thing to do 3084 01:59:17,080 --> 01:59:23,320 is to move up to Seattle and join the gay greater Pacific Northwest Pollachule. But it's so 3085 01:59:23,320 --> 01:59:30,280 Seattle. No, it's so green and gloomy in Seattle all the time. If the weather was nice, 3086 01:59:30,280 --> 01:59:35,800 I'd get it, but seriously, that's the hill you want to die on. I mean, especially the keeper 3087 01:59:35,800 --> 01:59:41,160 of the Vancouver that keep talking about how nice it is that I'm going. It's right next to Seattle. 3088 01:59:41,160 --> 01:59:48,280 It can't be that nice. Well, but it is sometimes I've seen pictures. Well, yeah, there are the 3089 01:59:48,280 --> 01:59:55,160 half of the year. It's gorgeous. Vancouver at least is sane. Seattle is questionable. Well, 3090 01:59:55,160 --> 02:00:01,720 instead, instead of bashing on places, who's got any more funny name stuff? Well, we have 3091 02:00:01,720 --> 02:00:06,520 called my sister a fair few funny names. I'd like to share them. One of them was pooped 3092 02:00:06,520 --> 02:00:12,520 prints on my ass. So hey, that was mine. She stole that. I guarantee them older than her. 3093 02:00:14,520 --> 02:00:18,920 Don't try her. She'll time travel and fight you for it. I know. If you want to 3094 02:00:18,920 --> 02:00:25,720 active time travel scalability in the offers winning position, you always, if you want to 3095 02:00:26,440 --> 02:00:31,160 always have to let the villain think they're winning. If you want a funny name, I went to school with a 3096 02:00:31,160 --> 02:00:39,160 guy called Adam Schittler. No, I'm not joking. At least it wasn't at all. I thought it was about 3097 02:00:39,160 --> 02:00:46,600 I'm sure. I'm sure I'm sure his dad was sat there with the baby now. It's just going 3098 02:00:46,600 --> 02:00:53,560 please and his mom was like, no, please. No, fine. Adam, then. No, wait a minute. What about 3099 02:00:53,560 --> 02:01:02,040 on the altar? Like, hey, baby, I know we have a proud long Schittler history to uphold here. But 3100 02:01:02,040 --> 02:01:09,560 can we at least hypheny? Like, pineapple hyphen Schittler? Can, but it's something. Yeah. Adam, pineapple 3101 02:01:09,560 --> 02:01:14,440 Schittler. Okay. So the first of your name, Schittler Schalen, just like you wanted. 3102 02:01:16,200 --> 02:01:21,080 This, I want the enterprise level. I don't want the econobox one of those. I want the enterprise. 3103 02:01:21,080 --> 02:01:29,320 Are they? I thought the enterprise was in dry dog to me threads. No, I'm sorry. I'm talking to my dad. 3104 02:01:30,040 --> 02:01:34,680 I couldn't hear you for that. I'm sorry you're talking to your dad too, but we understand. 3105 02:01:37,640 --> 02:01:42,520 You have been listening to Hecker Public Radio at Hecker Public Radio does work. 3106 02:01:42,520 --> 02:01:47,880 Today's show was contributed by a hatebird in this night like yourself. If you ever thought 3107 02:01:47,880 --> 02:01:55,640 of a coin podcast, click on our contributely to find out how easy it means. Hosting for HDR 3108 02:01:55,640 --> 02:02:02,760 has been kindly provided by an onsthost.com, the Internet Archive and our Sync.net. 3109 02:02:02,760 --> 02:02:07,800 On this otherwise stages, today's show is released on our Creative Commons, 3110 02:02:07,800 --> 02:02:20,680 Attribution for Pointo International License.